Hope & Change, Inc.: Obama Denies Libya War Is ‘War,’ While Escalating It

  mr. bullshit

It's been a long time, a long time coming, but I know, a change is gonna come ....America’s new war is One Week Old, hooray! Did you get it a present? (Yes: You are actually paying for this war, too.) Barack Obama conveniently went into hiding in South America — ha, we thought Bush would disappear there first! — and because South America is a very primitive continent with no Internet or telephones or video or whatever, he was unable to do his usual fifty televised press conferences per day to explain why he started this new war, and what the point of this new war might be, and how long it will last, and how much it will cost, and whether it is or isn’t related to the U.N. resolution, and whether or not Washington wants “regime change” or just to “protect one side of the war, until the other side wins or loses.” Very confusing! It’s good that Obama has kind of “kept out of it,” when you think about it, because the guy could never even figure out how to explain why it might be a good idea for working people to have health coverage.

Anyway, we know how the Wonkette Community gets all pissed off whenever we write about the dismal failure that is Barack Obama and his Administration, so we just want to stop and reconsider. Okay. It turns out Barack Obama’s administration is, in fact, a shining success … as long as you’ve got a couple of million in defense stocks, or have an executive office on Wall Street, or just generally needed to hang onto your tax cuts because it is tough to get by on an income of a quarter-million per year. So tough, in fact, that some of our nation’s “middle rich” (below the top 1% but above the bottom 95%) had to raid their dividends to pay for some shit last year! Ouch.

Wired’s Danger Room, meaning Spencer Ackerman, has this to say:

While the president travelled through Latin America, his aides told sympathetic audiences in Washington that Operation Odyssey Dawn “is a limited humanitarian intervention, not war,” in the words of White House Mideast troubleshooter Dennis Ross. A letter to Congress notifying lawmakers that Odyssey Dawn was in effect studiously avoided the word “war,” preferring the more anodyne “military efforts” — which are “discrete” and “limited in their nature, duration, and scope.”

Ross’ remarks are outright deceptive. And it fits a pattern with President Obama: escalating U.S. military commitments while portraying them as essentially finite and limited.

 
Related video

For one thing, the fight is intensifying, not dropping off. On Sunday, the U.S.-led coalition flew 60 sorties over Libya; Monday it flew nearly 80; on Wednesday it flew 175. At this moment, American pilots are bombing and shooting at Gadhafi’s armor and artillery units on the outskirts of Libyan cities. Off the shores of Libya, a bevy of Navy ships and subs have launched over 160 Tomahawk missiles.

B-b-but NATO or somebody will take over soon, right? Once they figure out some stuff like, “is there another country that is the U.S. but is somehow not the U.S., that has thousands of war jets and bombers ready to go?” And as soon as they figure out what the “mission” is, other than “the U.S. spending hundreds of millions of dollars per day dropping bombs in North Africa,” NATO is going to “mop up” and we’ll always remember this fine little war, the same way we don’t remember Granada or Panama or whatever. (This war will never end, though, and will soon morph into the “Greater Libya-Iraq-Afghanistan-Pakistan Operation Masturbating Eagle Operation.” GK-I-A-PoME. Run out of a group of video game trailers on some Pentagon base in Florida.) [Danger Room]

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About the author

A writer and editor of this website from 2006 to early 2012, Ken Layne is occassionally seen on Twitter and writes small books and is already haunting you from beyond (your) grave.

View all articles by Ken Layne

Hola wonkerados.

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197 comments

  1. Terry

    “is there another country that is the U.S. but is somehow not the U.S., that has thousands of war jets and bombers ready to go?”

    I'd suggest France, just for the comedy of it, but wouldn't want to put the Libyan people through that.

    1. Preferred Customer

      I propose Germany and Italy. Germany and Italy, fighting in North Africa…what could go wrong?

      1. SorosBot

        Italians fighting the North Africans again? Dido's curse must still be active, after all these millennia.

    2. Pithaughn

      Seems like the perfect place for a lend lease, the US defense contractors win, NATO wins, Moamar loses.
      For more free statesmanship please visit me on Facebook.

  2. SorosBot

    Of course I remember Panama; Van Halen rocked back then, before they replaced David Lee Roth with Sammy Hagar.

    1. BaldarTFlagass

      I was always kind of amazed that Hagar was able to both ruin his solo career and destroy Van Halen with that single move.

  3. hagajim

    Operation Odyssey Dawn = Operation Blow The Fuck out of Ghadafi…that's a much better name don't ya think?

    1. vodkamuppet

      That sounds suspiciously like having an actual purpose, that's not how Bammerz rolls these days.

    2. ArmoredBore

      Either way, it beats Georgie Jr.'s cheesy crap like Enduring Freedom or Iraqi Freedom. Those must've taken several seconds to think up!

      1. HistoriCat

        Nothing will ever beat Operation Just Cause for that "no no – we're not totally trying to justify what we're doing" vibe.

  4. OneDollarJuana

    So much for American Exceptionalism, as we spend our way into decline and obscurity, just as every other empire has. We haven't even produced many long-lasting stone sculptures, so given a few hundred years we will be just that mysterious culture that destroyed not just it's environment, but every one else's, too, and then disappeared. The only deeper mystery will be that series of islands near East Asia where no-one can go anymore.

    1. ArmoredBore

      That's always bugged me whenever people go on about how the US is the greatest, bestest country in the history of countries. I mean, look at some place like the UK; they have castles and crap, but what do we have? McDonalds?

      Here's to our gradual decline into a thin layer of plastic fragments sandwiched between the ancient shale and an eon's-worth of mud!

  5. Ken Layne

    It's like a rabbit vibrator in a plain discreet box — but then the vibrator fucks you to death, through the skull, and sends the bill to your family.

    1. neiltheblaze

      Do the Tomahawk missiles come in discreet packaging too? With a ribbon and a nice get well card.

      1. jus_wonderin

        I especially liked the "and sends the bill to your family". Some folks just have the knack!! Thanks Ken.

    2. user-of-owls

      Damn, I didn't even know rabbits had vibrators. I mean I'd heard about gerbils and Richard Gere's anus, but this?

  6. Gopherit

    If we don't use up some of our ordinance and missiles, how will companies like Raytheon get new contracts? Huh? Betcha didn't think of that. THINK OF THE CHILDREN.

  7. El Pinche

    "War is when you blow shit up."
    -Richard Belzer

    We're at fuckin war. Barry Warbucks, please don't bomb Mohali, India on March 30 …I have some major stakes on Pakistan in the Pak vs India semi final. Now that's WAR.

  8. ApplesauceRobot

    This brings to mind an old Cold War joke:

    What did one Soviet tank commander ask the other Soviet tank commander as they were dining in a Paris cafe?

    "So, who won the air war?"

  9. edgydrifter

    Dear Libya,
    We're going to humanitarian intervention the shit out of you.
    XOXOX
    B. Obama

  10. DahBoner

    Chill out, Motherfuckers! He's got this!

    This is just another case of Obama playing 3-dimensional chess with us and rest assured he will only kill enough motherfuckers to prove to everyone that it's a shining victory on a hill somewhere, and another Nobel peace prize for bringing on such an awesome peace grooviness, down at the squat on Haight Street near Golden Gate park…

  11. forgracie

    1777–the French say naw–we don't wanna help those colonists struggling against the British. We're over extended.

    And you Ken, would be having tea and crumpets about now.

    Or perhaps Spring of 1991 after the liberation of Kuwait when Poppy Bush invites the Shiites to rise up against Saddam Hussein and we fail to enforce a no-fly zone as they get slaughtered in the marshes of southern Iraq.

      1. forgracie

        Does the national health care include dental because I'm just not seeing that in the population….

        1. DownFist Troll

          That, or Canada would have been much, much bigger.

          Serious for a moment: I Like the idea of the USofA doing the right thing, but we really haven't since ww2. Every time we intervene in a crisis it is because of economic or strategic reasons. I think the only reason we're involved in this is because the revolution stemmed the flow of oil. If we really were in the humanitarian business we would be in Darfur, or Gaza, or Ivory coast.

          By the way, the French only helped us to fuck over the British :S

    1. Ken Layne

      The fuck would I care if I had tea & crumpets today? Considering the part of North America that stuck with the British Empire is a far more humane and sane society than the one we have in the United States, I'd say the American revolution was a wash.

      /Or, if you were a slave or a servant, a fucking DISASTER.

      1. forgracie

        You do know you're free to go aboot your business up north don't ya? Maybe you could be a lumberjack….or go work in the tar sands….

  12. Extemporanus

    We're humanitarianly intervening over there so that we don't have to humanitarianly intervene over here.

    1. natoslug

      As a parent, I'd love some humanitarian intervention here. Or maybe just some education funding and more booze.

  13. comptoneffect

    Ok, Obama is a dismal failure. I said it, are you happy? Just don’t my Teabagger parents know because they would never let me forget it.

    1. Crank_Tango

      I like to think of it this way: as presidents go, he's not that bad. As DEMOCRATIC presidents go, he is a fucking nightmare.
      I may or may not be wrong, but I don't care, that's how I look at him.

  14. Ken Layne

    Man, I used to live on Haight Street.

    /not the dirty hippie side, but the Urban Apocalypse-broken glass-screaming crack fiends-drunken-Irish-vomiting-in-gutters side.

    1. Extemporanus

      Ha, that reminds me:

      Did you see my buried reply to your Haight-related "teleported back to 1989" reply to my comment in the "Austrian nuclear radiation expert" thread from back on the 18th?

      Also, could the previous sentence be any more grammatically convoluted?

      And finally, who the hell are you talking to?!

  15. WhatTheHeck

    Operation Odyssey Dawn is a not so much a limited humanitarian intervention, but more an intervention to stabilize the price of oil.

    There, I fixed the press release.

  16. CliveWarren

    Libyans deserve the same kind of democracy as their western world counterparts! The kind where you get to vote on who exactly is ordering all the killing.

    There must be killing, that is what keeps the economy going – but it's nice to get to vote for a new bombarder in chief once in a while.

  17. memzilla

    Almost seventy years ago, we were bombing the s*** out of Japan and sending relief flights to Libya. Weird, huh?

  18. SexySmurf

    We should tell Obama there are teacher's unions in Libya; then he won't want anything to do with it.

    1. Crank_Tango

      for some reason the upfisty only let me click once on this. sorry you've already voted on this comment my ass.

  19. jus_wonderin

    Who the fuck names these things, anyway????? The same dude that picks paint names for Sherwin-Williams?

    1. Extemporanus

      It's determined by the general leading the operation, and is a combination of the name of the street that they intend to humanitarianly intervene first, and the name of their first collateral damage.

    2. AutomaticPilot

      Actually, I think you're on to something. We should auction off the naming rights to the war. That way, the winner (e.g., Operation Raytheon Humanitarianizer) gets its name out there and the war gets paid for! Win-win!

    1. user-of-owls

      Trick question. Nixon never got blown, full or otherwise. Now Spiro, on the other hand…

  20. SayItWithWookies

    This action definitely freaks me out. However, given that doing nothing could easily allow Libya, a fairly prosperous and secular nation with an advanced infrastructure, to descend into a long and hopeless civil war with lots of brutal massacres, this seems like the lesser evil, provided the action is brief and ends decisively. Letting it turn into Iraq circa 1998 — a third-world nation rife with misery, squalor and dangerous weapons — would probably suck worse.

    1. imissopus

      But it's so much snarkier to call Obama a dismal failure after a whole week of his doing something. Or not doing something else. Or not not doing the first thing. Or whatever.

      1. Ken Layne

        Yeah, that's what I do. "Snark."

        /I have never done "snark" and find the entire concept stupid & offensive. "Snark," as I understand it, is empty, vapid shit-talkin' about celebrities. While I certainly don't enjoy politics, what I write is political, and dead serious.

        1. imissopus

          Oh sorry: But it's so much snarkier more satirical to call Obama a dismal failure, etc. etc.

          I must have just been channeling David Denby for a minute.

    2. gef05

      Fair enough, Wookies.

      But Barry should at least have the balls to honestly describe the action.

      1. SayItWithWookies

        By its very definition, war is something that happens after a declaration of war — so it makes sense to avoid that term, since it hasn't applied to our various invasions and other conflicts since 1945. Getting worked up about that seems beside the point, though that hasn't stopped drudge et. al.

        And yes, providing all the logistical and technical support while letting someone else run things is also a semantic trick — aimed at showing everyone that it's not all about us and our president's daddy issues. It's mostly symbolic, yet it increases the responsibility of our allies and ideally minimizes the chances of Americans dying. I'm not gonna complain.

        1. gef05

          Don't misunderstand me – if Iran attacked Gadafi's forces I'd say "fair enough".

          It's just that my bullshit-o-meter explodes over things like "humanitarian intervention".

          /The whole "when is it "war"?" debate – that's a whole other conversation.

        2. HateMachine

          Woah, wait. Politicians made a calculated political maneuver on the stage of international politics? Say it ain't so.

          As far as I'm concerned, the goal here is worthy, and the means to do it are fairly straightforward, and acting costs us dollars wheras not acting costs the lives and well-being of a shit-ton of people in Africa. Isn't this the sort of thing us mincing librul gays are supposed to be in favor of?

          I refuse to get my man-panties in a twist because Barry didn't say the right thing to Congress and CNN.

      1. HateMachine

        The people of Benghazi, Libya disagreed with you so strongly that they petitioned the UNSC to make this happen.

    3. HistoriCat

      I would feel a hell of a lot better about our actions in Libya if we weren't still "making progress" in Afghanistan. Can't help but feel that these open-ended military adventures have no clear goals and that we don't have the will to commit full resources necessary to finish things off.

  21. Cicada

    The NYT just posted and article about how it looks like NATO is headed towards agreement on the Libya hand-off. I literally read it right before clicking over here and had a weird moment of reading through Ken's piece assuming it was based on the same article. It didn't compute, to say the least.

    Anyhoo, here's the link: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/25/world/africa/25

    Britain, France, Turkey, and the U.S. have all signed on so far. We shall see.

    1. Ken Layne

      It doesn't *matter* who's in charge, on paper. Only the USA has the firepower and the planes and all the other shit you get from spending more on your military than the rest of the world combined.

      Afghanistan is a NATO war, too.

      1. Cicada

        I understand that, but your last paragraph contradicted the facts in the NYT article, hence the disconnect.

        ETA: Or maybe you weren't being sarcastic in the way I thought you were. I just reread the last paragraph and see that I could have interpreted it incorrectly. Damn snark, how does it work?

  22. lochnessmonster

    There is nothing more humanitarian than dropping bombs on a country and further ticking off it's crazed dictator!

  23. Come here a minute

    All this dithering has caused untold damage to the fabulous patriot freedom fighters in Libya. For SHAME!

    Also, Obama is being reckless, too.

  24. DonnyKerabotsos

    Now we just need to send a mechanized infantry brigade through the halls of Montezuma and we'll have all the bases covered.

  25. weejee

    Didn't the Soviet Union do this military overreach some years back…
    ♪♫ And the wall came tumbling down ♫♪

    Now we have the ShrubBarry All-arms Crap overreach…
    ♪♫ And the Wall Street came tumbling down ♫♪

    Only thing is the Wall Streeters offshored their for real assets years ago and honestly they won't give a shit if the ol' USA tanks. This would be companies like Dick Cheney's beloved Halliburton moving its headquarters to Dubai.

  26. DahBoner

    We're the survivors; a black survival
    In this age of technological inhumanity
    We're the survivors black survival
    Scientific atrocity, we're the survivors
    Atomic mis-philosophy, we're the survivors
    Nuclear mis-energy
    It's a world that forces lifelong insecurity
    All together now we're the survivors
    –Bob Marley

  27. LesBontemps

    Couldn't he just bomb Ghadafi with tax cuts and crappy health insurance reforms? It's certainly working to bring America to its knees.

  28. DahBoner

    But we'll never know what would have happened if we had choose the Operation Lethal Pancakes option…

    1. neiltheblaze

      I think the Fundies are living that right now, judging from that other post about the Fat Idiot Slobs of America – or FISA. Oh wait…..

  29. jus_wonderin

    I don't think everybody is taking the same side. But the site lends itself to the extreme comment, for the fun of it.

    I agree. Obama hasn't failed in everyway in my book. But, I wish sometimes he had a bit more backbone. And true, we could be in a total shitstorm if McCain and Ms. Sarah had made it in.

  30. poncho_pilot

    Odyssey Dawn? wasn't that a late '60s/early '70s psychedelic prog rock band? i think John Kerry and Mike Huckabee were in it. i know, two bass players, right? who did they think they were, Ned's Atomic Dustbin or Delta 5?

  31. DarwinianDemon

    I don't think he's always done his best, but I do think overall there is a generally positive movement forward. DADT is gone, the government doesn't pay a third party to lend to students, HCR has meant my cousins have coveerage while they ffinish school, we aren't acting like unilateral assholes for once. I have a ton of disappointments too, but jesus, I'm not going to play the "he's as bad as bush" cabecause bush didn't do Anything good. Ever.

  32. poncho_pilot

    i mean this in a very broad, general way and in no relation to you: i think the important thing is not to make the mistake of whitewashing or apologizing for our leaders when they fuck up. they should all be held accountable for their actions regardless of party. that's the mistake the right seems to make a lot much to their detriment–and ours. it's important to be honest about it all and understand when there are mitigating circumstances and when there aren't. that being said, i think i mostly agree with your comment. every situation is more complex then it appears on the surface which is the other mistake the right makes: refusing to recognize that. it's easier to wrap your mind around the world if you make it a matter of black and white. (not a pun about Obama.)

    1. vulpes82

      Precisely, poncho. As I said, I don't think anyone has a problem with Ken criticizing Obama. I'd criticize Obama over the union thing (I think he was right to keep a low profile over Wisconsin because that's just what the Repubs would have wanted, but he could be more forceful about supporting unions in general) or gay marriage (stop hedging and hawing about civil unions and just say gay people can get married!), to take just two instances. It's just that Ken and some others seem to think Obama has done not one good thing as president. I'm just as frustrated when I hear that sort of sentiment coming from the left as when it comes from the right; heck, I'm more so because they should "know better."

  33. Toomush_Infer

    My fourteen year-old great-nephew who now lives with us informed me this morning on the way to school that Religion had nothing to do with wars, historically….nope, it's "asshole egotists who think the world should owe them allegiance, and always has been"….I was silent the whole rest of the way….

  34. BarackMyWorld

    Barack Obama, Glenn Beck, and Ed Shultz are sitting in a boat with the Pope. The Pope's hat blows off. Glenn tries to grab the hat, but misses it. Ed tries to grab the hat and misses it. The hat lands in the water, so Obama gets out of the boat, walks across the water, and gets the Pope's hat back. The next day on TV, Ed wants to know why Obama didn't just buy the Pope a new hat and Glenn is accusing Obama of not being able to swim.

  35. problemwithcaring

    As a good American citizen, I know that the Obama administration is a failure, but I am not clear on the reasoning as of this week: Is the administration a failure because Obama isn't aiding "the brave and lonely rebels" or because he is aiding the rebels or because he is aiding the rebels only as a corporatist like Bush would?

    1. HateMachine

      I think it was that it didn't feel warm and fuzzy enough for the American People and the Arab League when we started shooting down the Libyan Air Force.

      Or maybe it was that since most of our wars in the past century have been evil imperialist/corporatist police actions, this action in direct accordance with a UNSC resolution, explicitly requested by the people of the country in question, and led by a REAL multinational coalition must be just another evil police action.

      Or maybe it was that intervening in an area that genuinely needs it in a way that is appropriate and welcome is wrong if someone somewhere has vaguely suspect motives.

      It's so hard to keep track!

  36. problemwithcaring

    Everybody can miss me with that "he is the same as Bush" shit.

    But I respect people who don't plan on waiting until Obama's administration kills as many Brownz as Bush did before they call them out on it.

    My brief moment of earnestness: I am immensely pleased that Wonkette continues to snark the issues progressives care about – fuck the party/government line (even when I don't agree.)

    1. vulpes82

      Here, here. Wonkette should snark on all and sundry! And I don't want us all to cheer Obama as he drinks the blood of brown babies or whatever just because he's "ours." Let's be honest, he has a lot of Brownz to go before he approaches Bush, and even if he did, "just like Bush" is still kind of a stretch when you take his whole administration into consideration.

      1. imissopus

        I'm sorry to tell everyone this, but somewhere down the page Layne informs me that he does not do "snark" and finds the whole concept "stupid & offensive." I hope this clears up any confusion about his writing.

    2. zhubajie

      "Everybody can miss me with that "he is the same as Bush" shit."

      He's blacker and somewhat more eloquent. Otherwise, not much different.

  37. Beowoof

    No republican asked, no republican cared. They care about power for its own sake. So any chance they get, its the black guy screwed up. The also hate the fact that he is smarter than most of them and occasionally, (not often enough), he comes out and whacks them around some and they are left scratching their balls or their friends balls in the case of Larry Craig, Mark Foley et.al.

  38. gef05

    For me it's not the compromise. It's the tissue-thin spin being put on the compromise that is repugnant.

    1. HateMachine

      I prefer my spin to be thicker and "quilted" (as the industry for such products puts it), so as to be gentler on my, um, gentleness when I wipe.

    2. SayItWithWookies

      Hey, if the most repugnant thing about this conflict is a thin veneer of doubletalk, that is change I can believe in.

      Another factor that hasn't been discussed (and I think that's on purpose) is Libya's nuclear technology. A breakdown of society would probably cause everyone to lose track of a lot of hardware, ore and brainpower. What if that were to fall into the hands of, say, those pernicious Maltese?

      1. Negropolis

        Hey, if the most repugnant thing about this conflict is a thin veneer of doubletalk, that is change I can believe in.

        I keep looking at the criticisms of this operations, and ultimately, they all come back to the fact that Bush ruined war. I've heard everything from "I'd be all right with it if we weren't in ______." among a few other (and better) ones. You know, as if the imminent massacre of civilians during a region-wide uprising is preferable because we're too tired/broke. What kind of shit justification is that? It reminds me of the governor and legislature here in Michigan that are currently arguing that extending benefits to same-sex couples can't be done, at the moment, because we're in a fiscal deficit.

        You know, as if human and civil rights are dependent upon monetary cost.

  39. SorosBot

    What's this, disagreement and criticisms of Obama? But I though that, as the Breitbart trolls say, we all have a hive-mind and worship Obama in an almost religious manner. It's almost as if that's just projection from them.

    1. Gleem_McShineys

      Projection? from a Breitbot? HELL YES!

      That is kind of the best thing ever: not only are the Breitbags just plain dicks, but their dogma actually REQUIRES THEM to be apologists for horrible shitgoblins on the order of George W, and Sarah Lou T.

      I'm thinking that kind of craven bungsmoochery has to hurt their tattered pride/jizzrags, just a little.

  40. OneYieldRegular

    The Onion got it exactly right the first time around, after 9/11:

    Operation Regrettable Inevitability

  41. Bluestatelibel

    All's I want to know is what Obama's going to do when it hits the U.S., when, just as in the Middle East, the poor slubs get sick of no jobs/worthless jobs, escalating food prices, and the parade of plutocrats prancing around in private jets. Will John McCain be the first to advocate opening fire on the protesters or Joe Lieberman, that's the only question I have.

  42. donner_froh

    Screw it–the Vietnam formulation is much better: "We had to destroy the village in order to save it."

    Makes the point without all this humanitarian, R2P, blah, blah blah.

  43. HateMachine

    Gosh, I feel like I missed the boat on this one. I haven't turned on an American news station or read an American newspaper in a week or two, and here it turns out that I'm supposed to be mad about the international intervention in Libya! I feel so embarassed!

    This is what I get for choosing instead to read the rather fantastic reporting done by Al Jazeera English on the actual conditions on the ground in Libya, and what was/is happening to the Libyan people. I should have known better than to read all the reports of artillery and bombers assaulting Benghazi and snipers killing people in Misurata for the crime of living in that city. I foolishly thought that such reporting was relevant when I saw it reflected in stories in American publications like this one: http://wonkette.com/440632/and-while-we-looked-th

    When will I learn to pay attention to what's really important, like Important America's national media (print, TV, and bloggery) covering their Important President and what he had to say about all of this? I completely forgot that if the President of the United States of America didn't say exactly the right thing to Congress and the media, those browns over there in North Africa would have to just do without a rescue.

    God, I feel pants-on-head retarded now.

    1. Negropolis

      I know, right? Obama is so incredibly morally weak for preventing a massacre where he could and where it finally matched up with our interests and values. Since we've been so late to the party or didn't come at all before, we should have just probably sat on our hands. You know, because beng inconsistent and cynical before means that the US government should never try anything ever again for fear of botching it. We also should have sat this one out, because defense contractors love military intervention. We should have sat this one out because we need to really rest up for our next big one. And, also, we should have sat this one out because K'Daffy only threatened to raze Benghazi and was only en route to he. He hadn't really done anything, yet, right? Plus, he super pinkie promised that he was really so cool with the protestors, at least the ones that put down their arms. Only the armed ones would be shown no mercy and strangled with chicken wire in their bedroom closests, ok?

      MoMo GoDaddy isn't morally weak; he's just doing what dictators do, right? Mallomar is horrible for wanting to raze his nation's second biggest city to the ground, but Obama is even worse for wanting to prevent that by involving us in it, right? Also remember that sense we're not 100% who the rebels are, that we can't know who the beliigerent in the situation is. I mean, we totally didn't see MoMo flying helicopters above Benghazi shooting his people down in the streets and sniping them from the roofs, capiche? The rebels and K'Daffy are on the same moral footing as far as we're concerned, right?

      I mean, since we can't do and know everything all of the time, we shouldn't ever do anything at all, right? Those Libyan protestors were so fucking stupid; why were they out protesting, anyway, and why the fuck did they run into K'Daffy sniper fire? They should have got the fuck out of the way, went home, and waited for MoMo's police to murder them in their bathrooms like the international community wills it.

  44. Guppy06

    "“is there another country that is the U.S. but is somehow not the U.S(?)"

    I have the perfect solution to this quandary: CANADA! Neither the US nor EU want to be holding the bag, but still want "NATO" involved, so that leaves only one logical conclusion!

  45. Tommmcatt

    You and I have the luxury of saying that. Obama does not. Not getting involved would put us on the wrong side of history- it would be tantamount to supporting a Dictator becoming more genocidal by the minute.

    And as for the spin, again, what is he supposed to say? Give a Churchill-style speech about providing Freedom to the Arabs? He'd be flayed alive by the left for that.

    Look, I'm not saying there isn't some kind of sweetheart deal somewhere in this for the United States..there obviously is a payoff, or we wouldn't be in there. I am saying that International Politics is a skanky, morally repugnant business at best- because people die very often because of the fallout from decisions made selfishly by leaders concerned with their country above all else. We need to support the ouster of this dictator, because at this point in time there is both the means and the international will to do so- regardless of the fact that I am sure there's some sweet, sweet crude wrapped up in all of this somehow. And to expect Obama to wade in to this fight and not get blood on his suit is, frankly, a childish expectation.

    Before I get flamed on this, though, I'd like you to pause and ask yourself how many times you've criticized the United States for being involved with guys like Kaddaffi, and then ask yourself again how fair it is to criticize this President for trying to get him out.

    1. zhubajie

      History has no sides. History is just what people do and what otherpeople write up. I expect Morlock types will be massacreing Libyansten years from now.Zhu Bajie

      1. Negropolis

        Yeah, just keep up with that convenient moral relativity bullshit. You know, that faux ambiguity that gives a person an excuse never to act on fucking anything, because there is no such thing as right or wrong or good or bad.

        1. zhubajie

          “History is little more than the register of the crimes, follies andmisfortunes of mankind.” — Edward Gibbon

          1. Tommmcatt

            And? It looks like a response, but really, it expresses nothing. Nice taste in authors, though.Sent from my iPad

    1. glamourdammerung

      It was kind of amusing to see how fast the Retard-Americans became concerned with bombing the browns once President Obama got involved.

  46. Chet Kincaid

    I for one am sick of the Libtard naiveté or hypocrisy or whatever it is in some quarters on "Peace." Peace is not an end in itself, and the Revolutionary Change we supposedly favor in so many circumstances is incompatible with warm and fuzzy air-headed "Peace." If your enemy is incapable of shame (i.e. you're not lucky enough to be Gandhi or King) you had better cowboy the fuck up, if you want justice.

    As for President Failure, maybe you should have paid attention when he said he's not against all wars, just dumb ones.

    1. HateMachine

      Hell yes. It's honestly pretty disappointing to read the sort of commentary that comes from both Layne and the rest of the Wonkeratti on this story, not two weeks back: http://wonkette.com/440632/and-while-we-looked-th… and compare it to the pissing and moaning I'm seeing here.

      Remember Clinton, guys? Us Liberals used to get off on this sort of thing.

      1. DarwinianDemon

        OMG, I was starting to think I dreamed that post! I *thought* I remembered people being pissed off we weren't doing anything to help Libya. good find.

    2. vulpes82

      I do wonder if I was just crazy, or if other people were, when it was totally clear that Obama wasn't a hippy peacenik, just not an insane warmonger like McCain, who would have had us nuking Iran, invading Egypt, and lobbing missiles at North Korea before Libya was even a consideration.

  47. KenLayIsAlive

    Is this about peace, or is this about getting rid of Gadhafi (which will require killing a lot of people)? It is too soon to tell, by my money is that we are NOT actually some glorious shining light protecting a bunch of angelic freedom-loving peaceniks from the latest murderous skull-humping devil (who has been our friend for 8 years now).

    Srebrenicia happened under a No Fly Zone, with UN troops on the ground. What can we really do about two groups of people who have both decided to kill each other? If we are going to bomb, shouldn't we at least support some kind of peace talks in tandem?

    I mean, I don't get the impression we even know we have our shit together. The military seems to be on a different page than the administration. As it is, I don't think much has really happened and up to now, nah, I don't think this is a big deal – but if it goes on for too long and gets messy, then this has massive fuck up written all over it.

    Libyan rebels appear to take leaf from Kadafi's playbook http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-

  48. PublicLuxury

    I am disappointed in Hopey this month. Maybe it's just PMS. Maybe it is 'The Change". Maybe it's because the husb wants his dick in Ann Coulter's throat so he can feel HER (?) Adam's apple. I dunno. I'm just disappointed.

    Are there meds for that?

  49. athodyd

    Hmm, I wonder what's on the news right now?

    Oh interesting, it looks like enforcement of the (ENDLESS ETERNAL INFINITE QUAGMIRE) no-fly zone is already being transferred to NATO, and that US diplomats are pressing for NATO to assume even more responsibility over a UN- and Arab-League-approved intervention.

    God, it's really wonderful to see Ken Layne be so profoundly, majestically wrong. Not just because (as Layne himself pointed out barely a week ago: http://wonkette.com/440632/and-while-we-looked-th… Qaddafi is a murderous thug who has now suddenly found his ability to death-stomp his way through the opposition greatly hindered by French jets and American missiles, and not just because the obvious American push for a NATO takeover reflects an administration that is actually welcoming of meaningful international collaboration instead of treating everyone else as a sidekick, but because this post really cements just how shitty Wonkette has become under Layne's editorship.

    I've been reading Wonkette at work or on my phone or wherever for maybe three or four years. I posted from time to time before everything switched over to the IntenseDebate format. At that point I couldn't be bothered because every third fucking article was an anus burger joke, or a fat teabagger in a scooter joke, or any number of incredibly lazy, dull, boring cliches where once you could find either surprisingly incisive political commentary or a funny joke OR EVEN BOTH.

    I don't care that much that Layne hates Obama because I'm pissed off at that sneaky fucker too, but Layne's coverage of anything the president does is covered in such a thick layer of rabid frothy rage that you can't figure out what the point was beyond "Ken is mad because Obama is still smoking or something." His writing is something I would expect from Jim Newell if he had spent an entire month huffing paint, or from Glenn Greenwald if he had some kind of massively debilitating stroke, or if Alex Pareene was actually technically dead but some sort of weird gastric medical anomaly made his corpse occasionally belch out a half-assed joke about Sarah Palin.

    Time to hand the keys over to Stuef clown shoes. Find some other site to run into the ground.

    1. Mumbletypeg

      Hm. Well, I figure you’ve been reading Wonkette longer than I have, yet I recognize what you’re saying in your observation of a format or a voice or a tone that’s changed over time.
      If it’s 3 or 4 years you mean, and I don’t know you but, myself, I could ask anyone around me, an informal poll, and they’d sketch a portrait of serial, personal nosedives. Two neighbors who survived the 2008 economic downturn lost jobs in these past 3 months. Cast a little further out and there’s my friend in Hampton Roads Correctional, having served full sentence for robbery since 1994, now detained til we can ship him on a tide of anti-immigrant sentiment to his native-born Cambodia away from his family here. A little further up the road is the White House where a lot of hope for belief-worthy change to materialize, subsisted for a while in the form of a campaign slogan and some good intentions, and is now fraying in the face of wicked, weird reality.
      I can recall taking the ill news of the earlier days with a dose of mirth; meaning, how we howled at Dana Carvey’s rendition of G. Bush the First and we relished the gimmickry like Ollie’s Pack o’ Lies playing cards. But the lens I see through now is dark, dark. It gets leavened with some humor here at Wonkette. That used to be gleaned from other sites before this and no doubt my attention will meander elsewhere again. I think there’s something about your forthrightness that I want to acknowledge as a positive but at the same time, if it’s not worth your while… I’d try to stay solid with what you remember enjoying about the company kept here when you enjoyed it; it’s obvious you’ve moved on, and now that you’ve vented some air, you’d better feel better.

  50. SkinnyNerd

    He is just bracing us for when the Nobel committee awards the economics prize to Blankfein, Bernanke, Greenspan, Paulson, and what the hell, Madoff too.

  51. Negropolis

    Obama is so incredibly morally weak for preventing a massacre where America finally could. Since we've been so late to the party or didn't come at all before, we should have just probably sat on our hands. You know, because beng inconsistent and cynical before means that the US government should never try anything ever again for fear of botching it. We also should have sat this one out, because defense contractors love military intervention, and we should always totally judge the respectability of an idea solely on which groups do or don't buy into it. We should have sat this one out because we need to really rest up for our next big one. And, also, we should have sat this one out because K'Daffy only threatened to raze Benghazi and was only en route to the place. He hadn't really done anything, yet, right? Plus, he super pinkie promised that he was really so cool with the protestors, at least the ones that put down their arms. Only the armed ones would be shown no mercy and strangled with chicken wire in their bedroom closests, ok?

    MoMo GoDaddy isn't morally weak; he's just doing what dictators do, right? Mallomar is horrible for wanting to raze his nation's second biggest city to the ground, but Obama is even worse for wanting to prevent that by involving us in it, right? Also remember that sense we're not 100% who the rebels are, that we can't know who the beliigerent in the situation is. I mean, we totally didn't see MoMo flying helicopters above Benghazi shooting his people down in the streets and sniping them from the roofs, capiche? The rebels and K'Daffy are on the same moral footing as far as we're concerned, right?

    I mean, since we can't do and know everything all of the time, we shouldn't ever do anything at all, right? Those Libyan protestors were so fucking stupid; why were they out protesting, anyway, and why the fuck did they run into K'Daffy sniper fire? They should have got the fuck out of the way, went home, and waited for MoMo's police to murder them in their bathrooms like the international community wills it.

    I'm so through with Obama. I texted him, like, ten times, last night, and he told me he was still at work, but I knew he was out screwing some floozy. And, he doesn't kiss me exactly like I want him to do, anymore, and he never remembers to take off his shoes at the door, anymore. Fuck 'em. I'm getting a divorce.

    Barry's response to Libya proves that he is sooo morally weak. When my president gets a 3 AM call, he better press the button and send that bitch to voicemail. 'Cause, Libya be trippin', yo. She always be callin' like "My pops' about to murder me because I had an opinion." We can't be bothered with that shit.

    Fuck Libya, and the nascent democratic movement her broke, poverty-striken ass rode in on. Libya is so totally not worthy of outside intervention. Gaddhafi, you got to level a few more cities and murder a few thousand more "rebels", first, but we're not promising to come get you even then.

  52. undeadgoat

    I remember when I thought Barack Obama was something new and shiny and different. I miss those days.

    Santos 2012? PLEASE?

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