Barack Obama has heard that people on the left don’t like his compromise on tax cuts. Tough. You know what he has to deal with? He says the Republicans took the American public hostage. Have you ever had to deal with hostage takers? No you haven’t. They are not normal. You know who else isn’t normal? Democratic ideologues. This guy can’t stand them — as you can see from him blowing off pent-up steam about the health care debate — and he’s not working with them anymore. It’s just going to be him and the American public hiding in an undisclosed location for the next couple of years. He will protect them in his arms. You ideological freaks can die for all he cares.
Here is the hostage clip. Hah:
But back to the first clip: “This is the public option debate all over again,” pissed Obama says. Extending the Bush tax cuts for the middle class and not extending them for the wealthy is ideology. And sticking to it instead of dealing with reality is something cartoonish intellectual elites do in their silly elite newspapers made out of $100 bills smeared with caviar-based ink. And it is wrong.
Of course, ideology has to come from somewhere. And in this case it came from Barack Obama. Sure, others had a similar position on the Bush middle-class tax cuts in the past. But it was not a time-worn tenet of Democratic ideology. It was a position codified into the Democratic agenda by Obama himself in the 2008 campaign.
“I’m tired of that town Washington telling us what we can’t do,” Obama said there in 2007, yet to know the true depths of human exhaustion, obviously, because he is obviously VERY TIRED and CRANKY of all this crap today. “We’re assured… there’s no problem that can’t be solved by another tax break that the wealthy didn’t need and half the time didn’t even ask for. But we’ve tried that way for the last six years. We’re ready to try something new. We’re hungry for something new. It’s time to turn the page and write a new chapter in American history.”
And now, that large, erect thing in Barack Obama’s pants does not mean he is happy to see you. It means that thing in his pants is the Washington Monument. Because now Barack Obama is Washington. Barack Obama is telling us what we can’t do. And what we can’t do is stop giving tax cuts to the wealthy. Although Obama is criticizing others here, and trying to relate it to an aspect of the health care debate, he’s really criticizing his own campaign rhetoric.
Pissed Obama has evolved out of Emo Obama in the month after the midterm elections, and Pissed Obama does not care what Campaign Obama used to say about things.
Of course, this happens to pretty much every president, and every politician, vis-a-vis campaign promises. But here’s something you notice when looking through YouTube for past remarks on tax cuts: Obama promised, resolutely, over and over, in vivid video sound bites, not to raise taxes on those earning less than $250,000 a year. He did not promise, out loud, in words, to raise taxes for those making above that level. So which of those parts of his plan do you think was more important to him?
He’s now running for office. He will not allow himself to be eaten by the YouTube. He’s not the kind of idiot who has to play around with a football every five minutes. This is about preservation of self, as much as, or more, than preservation of his beloved American public.
So now Obama, like many presidents before him, will carve out a comfortable place in the political center, free to snipe at members of both parties, content with the knowledge he made some progressive gains, even if he couldn’t reform the system itself, and sufficiently emo’d to the point where he is certain he cannot instill a predictable ideology in that official North Star™ common independent voter, the kind of person who picks up hodgepodge pieces of political convictions somehow without really paying attention to anything.
And everyone else will be faint, albeit more interesting, constellations. Or something. SPACE: IT’S A BIG THING.
But yeah, he’s totally wrong about this being a “compromise” thing. The only person he compromised with was his former self. [YouTube]
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Rest in peace Elizabeth.
So, "pissed Obama" = "caving to the Republicans' every demand…" Check.
Word is that RepubGovs wanted to start secession proceedings if this did not got through. Obama just stopped a shooting war.
As any Jungian analyst can tell you, Obama is in crises and is pissed with himself. He is projecting his anger onto those who have realized he is wearing the Emperor's clothes. He actually has a decent core, but is morally conflicted with what he perceives – falsely – to being limited to choosing the best of a host of bad choices. He rationalizes this by calling it "compromise," even though none of his heroes/idols (Lincoln, FDR) were compromisers when push came to shove. (It also doesn't help that he is surrounded by neoliberal advisers and Wall Street operatives.)
It is my firm opinion that this presidency will end badly.
"pissed Obama" = "BEING CALLED ON caving to the Republicans' every demand…"
It seems to me he's made a strategic mistake here. Because during the first part of his administration, when his party has control of both houses of Congress, he has defined "compromise" as "absolutely and completely capitulating to the demands of the opposing party while getting nothing in return but abuse and contempt."
So now, for the last two years of his administration, when his party does NOT have control of both houses of Congress, how is he going to define "compromise?" He's got nowhere to go.
Which I fear means that for the next two years John Boehner is going to force Obama to hold weekly press conferences in which the president repeatedly stabs himself in the face with a letter opener while calling himself "Susan." Obama will agree to this in the spirit of bipartisanship, recognizing inescapable political realities like the adult he is.
And the worst part is that the GOP will run something odious enough in 2012 to make it relatively easy to hold one's nose and pull the lever for Obama gain.
Not me. Never again.
Oh, you know you will. Protest voting is for schmucks and (literally) losers*.
*Unless the electoral vote in your state is a foregone conclusion by a large margin before voting day; in which case go ahead pull that lever for Nader until you both make your libtard O-face.
Yeah, the thought of "President Palin" will have me running over old folks & pushing kids out of the way to vote for Barry. And yes, it would just be a symbolic vote because we are a red state (unless those Messicans can keep pumping out the anchor/terror babies).
Seriously, its time to speed up the production of the anchor/terror babies and maybe spread 'em all over the deep south.
Meh. "President Palin" is already a foregone conclusion. We are outnumbered by morons who demonize education and glorify theofascist nationalism.
Well… it probably will be a foregone conclusion in my state, so call me Schmuck, I suppose.
Nor me. My district no longer uses machines with levers. Though voting for Obama in 2012 will be tantamount to pulling my pud. After which I will masturbate, in celebration of not living in Delaware.
I will vote for him again, and won't have to hold my nose, although I might feel a little sad. He's a better person than almost everyone else in this grand debate, us included. He is facing more than just the trend of conservative dickish competitive whoring for the rich, he is bucking the reality of corporate power and electoral influence, the growing scale of globalism, and the colossal stupidity of a large chunk of the American voting populace. If we have a dick of a president who makes some headway, but exacerbates the hostility between us and the COCKSUCKING AMORAL MONSTERS, is that a good bargain? Face it, the next move forward in equality, financial regulation, tax fairness, deficit reduction, and healthcare will probably come from a Republican. It's like Nixon visiting China and Clinton reforming welfare. They'll fight us tooth and nail until they are in power, when they can't continue the charade anymore and give in to reality.
Give in to reality? Teabaggers will never give in to reality.
I won't even bother to give you the well-known history of the Democrat trek rightward-ho, I will just say that you are one deluded dude.
"Face it, the next move forward in equality, financial regulation, tax fairness, deficit reduction, and healthcare will probably come from a Republican."
That part is certainly deluded, but for the most part I agree with Zvi. (OK, I would have gone with 'COCKGOBBLING AMORAL MONSTERS' rather than COCKSUCKING AMORAL MONSTERS.' Also.)
"It's okay if you're a Republican" doesn't just apply to hypocritical lapses in ethics and sexual mores. If Lindsey Graham or Bobby Jindal should support same sex marriage, they'd get a pass. If John Cornyn should say in a year or two that billionaires don't really deserve to be taxed, obviously, but this deficit thing is going to kill us, he'd get a pass. And if LBJ had traveled to Peking, a million redneck Birchers would have assassinated the shit out of him within a week of his return.
If I could spend weeks stomping around my city knocking on doors for John Fucking Kerry, it should be easy to vote for Obama like 500 times.
I'm pissed enough right now to agree completely. But I also don't see a path for him to do anything for the unemployed without some sort of capitulation. But this seems a lot like being forced to wear lipstick and kneepads, then thank them for the ass-rape.
The GOP rapscallion, demagogue or Teabag fondler who runs for Prez of these United Snakes in 2012 will claim that the GOP, not Barry, deserves ultimo credit for the 2 year tax-break extension, that without such an extension for the canapé munching/Dolce & Gabbana-burdened richy richies every last man, woman, and peeing toddler of us would be subsisting on unsalted crackers and sardines by now, and that he/she will make extension permanent lest the middle class soon find itself living in tattered refrigerator boxes above a germ-scented steam grate and Barry won’t do that because all he wants is for the classes to go after each like a bunch of yappy Chihuahuas who just missed their afternoon nap.
This assumes that Barry does not have a clever, clever plan to beat the Rethug candidate to the punch by convincing the Dems on the Hill to “compromise” by stretching out the tax cuts for the Mr. and Mrs. Thurston Howells of this benighted land for X more fucking years in exchange for the Rethugs not raising the Social Security retirement age to 85 or declaring war on Greenland.
EOM
Cause clearly when he said the tax cuts for the rich were bad for the economy he meant the tax cuts for the rich were bad for the economy unless the republicans really, really, really wanted them.
Now that Obama has capitulated, the Repubs will undoubtedly treat his policy proposals with respect in 2012, and will work for the betterment of the country as a whole, like the statesmen they are.
Ready for it in 3… 2… 1…
Obama is the best Republican president, evah.
Clinton was pretty good, too.
I remember Clinton. I'd love to have been a friend of Clinton's (if only to get the chubby interns). Obama is no Clinton.
Yeah, Obama actually got shit done in his first two years, rather than dicking around (literally and figuratively) and then lucking out that Newt Gingrich is even more of a hateful turd than we all thought. Even with that blessing, Clinton still never brought up healthcare again, deregulated every damn market he could and caved on welfare reform. Oh, and he fed the bullshit mythology that we could engage in nation building by bombing people all over the balkans. He sucked by every metric, but because he rode the upswing of a bubble we still have positive collective views of the guy.
I got laid a lot more during the Clinton years, so that might influence my views somewhat.
Chubby interns now that would be awesome.
Right, Mr. President. Remember, the Republicunts beat you because they love you.
Ha ha, he's blaming the hippies for the rich people screwing all of us… I guess this is that "8-dimensional chess" game he's supposedly a master of. What a schumck, also.
I don't know why Obama's pissed at us. All we did was take him at his word and elect his ass president. I agree with one thing though, this is the public option thing all over again. We got sold down the river and we're getting hosed for business as usual.
If he wants to rail at somebody, he's picking the wrong target. He should pound that podium till his hands bleed and shout "Those fuckers are holding America hostage!" from now till 2012.
Oh, and by the way: Anal rape ain't an abstract concept.
God bless Harry Reid!
I never expected to write that.
yeah cause harry reid's shown resolve at every turn when dealing with republicans.
nancy's the only dem republicans fear.
She has bigger balls than Barry or Harry.
The size of Goodyear, they are.
Harry could be more black than Obama right now. Like I said last week, he ought to be all, "I beat up crazy-ass bitches in the desert tougher than you."
Sadly, he's just next to cave with a fat-cat's herpetic dick in his mouth.
Use of herpetic = awesome.
Barry could counter that he had to beat up a crazy-ass bitch out on the tundra, but he was only half fighting her. The old man in the desert was first opn his list.
What about my 401-p? What about that? I made good dick jokes and other wholly irrelevant comments for those fucking p-diamonds, ya know.
We all feel your p-ain.
Our pees are actually Ken Layne's compassionate way of distracting us with shiny things so we don't feel the shit as the world collapses in on us. Who cares if we're in this handbasket careening toward hell, I just got another pee!
Much like the BCS standings, the calculation of p-points cannot be understood by dirty fucking hippies or any other members of the hoi polloi.
The p score is incomprehensible, thus useless. I get more of a kick out of the + number. If I don't get a double-digit comment at least once every couple of days, I know I'm off my game.
Sometimes I comb through my comments on Intense Debate and try to figure out why some of my comments are winners and some just fell flat.
Plus, I lust for a triple-digit comment. Never going to get one but we've all got a dream.
he's the only one up there with any sense. bound to be lonely.
It's like he thinks the job of government is to try and provide for the public welfare or something (however imperfectly).
If he just wouldn't play Charley Brown to the Republithugs Lucy. The Rs are dicks. Have always been dicks. We always be dicks. You cannot make them like you, Mr.President. Give up and start courting the people what brung you.
Yeah, don't hate him 'cause he's beautiful, right?
Give me a fuckin' break, you two.
i'm sorry, there was a lot of static on the line. i thought i heard you say, "break my fucker in two." was this correct? please retransmit.
Well, I hope he can find out what secret party all those "centrists" belong to and get them to carry him to victory in '12, instead of relying on his base. Because, who needs them? You know?
.
The child typist explains it all (not funny, but useful): http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2010/...
Relax fellow do-gooders. The game is stacked against him (hello Foxnews) so Obama had to dance a little. I betting only Neilist gets 100% of what he wants. The rest of us compromise and progressives make intelligent compromises. Forget the 30% of Americans that are useless Alaskunt morons. The middle 20% are just angry and confused. That's the 20% Obama needs to win 2012. The glass is half full (with gin in my case); We got a big stimulus. Yes the millionaires got a piece of it but OUR man comes out stronger than before; he proved that he's not a socialist Muslin and he took care of the middle class. Now we win 2012 then calmy do some other shit (like health care) that continues to mess with the morans. It's the dance.
Always look on the bright side of life
(whistle)
Life's a piece of shit,
When you look at it.
Life's a laugh and death's a joke, it's true.
You'll see it's all a show,
Keep 'em laughing as you go.
Just remember that the last laugh is on you.
This country was founded on compromise.
Who could forget the Compromise of Bunker Hill where the Minutemen bravely negotiated with the Red Coats until both sides reached an agreement.
Well, there was that compromise on slavery. Oh, wait, that didn't work out too well.
LOL, that comment would be interesting to post over at Red State or Breitbart to see what kinds of thumbs it would generate.
It'd be even more interesting if the second sentence were omitted.
or the 3/5ths compromise which was so awesome. or the US senate, which was a compromise between the big states and the small states. Those worked out really well, right?
How about the whole damn Constitution? I'm sorry, but this bullshit whining is tiresome. We are a nation of compromises, and every step forward this nation has made has been incremental. Don't like it, then by all means
BTW, seeing as how the Rebels (as they were then known) got their asses pounded off of Breed's Hill, and that was war rather than a minor policy disagreement, is that really what you want to go with?
but this bullshit whining is tiresome.
I agree, Obama's bullshit whining about the people who fucking voted for him is tiresome.
Christ am I glad to see someone on here playing devil's advocate.
I much enjoyed the compromise reached on the invasion of Iraq to address the thorny issue of: do we invade now or sooner?
And I like all of those oodles of compromises arrived at with the Dems during the Bush years. No, wait.
I think Obama is confusing us with Canada.
I love this.
Thanks for reminding me, Barry. I'd almost forgotten I'm still pissed at you about that one, too.
You know why this reminds me of the public option debate? Cause that was the last time his suckass negotiation skills cost the country something really valuable!
Why is it that the only people he gets tough with are his own base? It's like he's Barrack W. Bush.
Honestly the republitards must be very, very scary in meetings. They say, "Boo," and the democrats run screaming into the dark night, afraid of their own shadow certain the boogieman is going to get them.
At some point these terrified of their own shadow democrats need to be more afraid of the progressives/liberals than the republitards.
Someone needs to get xtine to cast a spell, get Nancy's astrolgers on the line, somebody channel Mary Lincoln's medium because we need to know when democrats are going to stand up for its constiuitents.
Yeesh, you'd think it is 2011 and democrats are in the minority in House.
Yes, he acts as if they're going to find out he's a Kenyan Muslin.
We are the compromise we've been waiting for.
All I want to know is when do I need to start making my feathers+leather+football padding with perhaps a hokey face mask armor?
"I won't be held to some 'Abstract Ideal'"
Like Hope? Or Change?
Fraud.
Yes, we can't.
"You can't hold me to my word! What do you think I am, some kind of fucking liberal?"
The War on Terror?
Fuck, that was brilliant.
Relax fellow do-gooders. The game is stacked against him (hello Foxnews) so Obama had to dance a little. I'm betting only Neilist gets 100% of what he wants. The rest of us compromise. Forget the 30% of Americans that are useless Alaskunt morons. The middle 20% are just angry and confused. That's the 20% Obama needs to win 2012. And then we do something else important (like healthcare) to annoy the wingnuts.
I'll bet you that 20% he needs to win in 2012 was predominantly in favor of making the rich pay their rates.
The travesty today is that he gave in to the fat-cats. Ultimately, he was worried that they wouldn't ante up in two years. Or, as Jack's astutely pointed out, he hypocritically reversed his promise. Strangely, his anger at US looks petty and out of character. Spin, Barry, spin, but you lost respect from a lot of intelligent, concerned liberals today.
And as to healthcare. It was a watered down, Republican bill anyway that only entrenched the Insurance companies and healthcare systems further. It just added another gov't bureaucratic layer to the insurance company layer.
Fuck Obamacare and fuck his "compromise."
But Obamacare gave 30 million people access to care, stopped desperate folks from getting thrown out of coverage and let me insure my 20 year old son. Not exactly worthy of a big fuck you. I like to save those for real special people. like Cheney and Madoff. Yea I'd like to hang the millionaires out to dry since they sucked the life out of USA, but we got to take what we can get… then we go back for more later.
Non, you got a point but I'm still torn between agreeing with Barry and being all pissed that he didn't threaten the Repigs with bringing Alan Grayson in to be his chief negotiator…that fucking Orange Bohner and Sen. McTwatwaddle woulda p-eed in their boots at the prospect of facing Grayson mano-a-mano, he'd have shoved his cardboard displays right up their wrinkled, old Repiglickin butts (ask me how I REALLY feel!)
Well, I'm real happy for you and your son, but I didn't have health insurance last year, I won't have it next year, and I won't have it by the time another presidential election rolls around. So forgive me if I think the "insurance reform" he won is less than I "hoped" for when I voted for him.
So for you, the glass is half empty. Or stolen by the Insurance lobby, or whatever.
Lots of people are better off under what got passed.
Let me reiterate. Obamacare is a watered down, Republican bill. The middlemen that double or triple our healthcare costs are only MORE imbedded between you and a healthcare provider. Those middlemen (don't forget healthcare systems) skated on the whole thing. We need a single payer system and not another layer of bureaucracy added to the tangle.
Obama was right when he said, "nobody's pulled the plug on granny."
If you get sick, you can go to an Emergency Room, and you will, by federal law (EMTALA) be taken care of. If you are disabled, you will receive Medicaid/Medicare. It's partial Socialism. The other part, the part you are talking about is "insurance coverage," and it's the Capitalism part. The greedy, Capitalistic, inhumane part. And Obamacare only protects and confounds the Capitalistic part.
And today, I don't give a damn about the 8 level chess politics and calculating machinations — Obama had a chance to stand strong and do something brave and noble. To stand up to the fucking assnut Repubs, to stand up to the "man", to stand up to the temptation of money. He didn't do that, he cannot spin that by me.
Further, I don't think ANY of the Bush tax cuts should be extended. You want war??? You afraid of terrorists??? Everybody needs to pay for them then.
Fuck it, I'll be a low "p" Radio tonite.
Here's how I see it: the Republicans gain a few seats and a bit more power, so some Democrats rush to give them back rubs and foot massages. Would you like some tea with your blow job, Massah Boehner? Excuse us for having something like a backbone.
I like that he's pissed — even if he's pissed at those of us who are pissed at him for not being pissed enough.
every time i see chuck todd i get bad 70s flashbacks.
Tim Russert's zombie would be better at the job of political reporter.
Tax cuts are not our "North Star" Mr. President. They aren't helping us live out our lives. A few thousand bucks extra back every year does not make up for continuing to not pay for Bush's wars. A few thousand bucks extra back every year does not make up for continuing to let our infrastructure crumble. A few thousand bucks extra back every year does not make up for a still-faltering economy. A few thousand bucks extra back every year might pay for a cheap hooker and enough booze to get through the first few months of the year, but after that, it would be nice if our fucking government chose to govern, not follow whatever the daily message is from John Boehner's shriveled nutsack. Man up already. As if I didn't have enough reasons to fucking drink. I want my hope and my fucking change, damnit. Raise the fucking taxes. What'd we have in 1954? Let's go to whatever those rates were, okay? I heard it was good to be white and middle-class back then.
Yeah, a goal of helping Americans to "live out our lives" does not sound all that inspirational (even though it may be more or less correct about what govts job should be): Let us dream of a day when we can all subsist together, so that we will be able to say, "at least we're not technically dead"!
Just make it through until you die and then make sure you don't spend too much time in the hospital on the way out.
It wasn't so great for those of us living in the projects at Hunter's Point in '54, and when we moved "up" to the projects at North Beach, it wasn't much better.
Hah, I KNEW you was a librul!
I will take your few thousand bucks every year and add them to mine, if you have no use for them. As for the rest of your agenda, you need to help "Nutless Barry" figure out how to get actual meaningful majorities in both houses in 2012, instead of blaming him for not using the omnipotence you believed he had.
I'm drinking my extra cash for now. I don't see how we could get "meaningful majorities" when we offer compromise and the repubs offer nothing but rage. I suppose I could hold out for a couple of line-item vetoes.
There is a staggering amount of pique going around these days. In reality Obamar is not tending the wheel of the Ship of State, he’s the Captain of the Pique-wad and trying to keep the teatarded Moldy Dick from sinking the whole shebang. This is why he sent
Queequegthe Veep up the Hill to be his shill. Or so he says, yeesh.For young people to capture this time, Crayola needs to add a suite of Pique-id colors to the old crayon box. For a start, how about:
Presidential Pique – renewal of Raw Umber, replaced in 1990/92
Ghey Pique – renaming of Mauvelous or Shocking Pink
Libtard Pique – renaming of Violet Blue or Radical Red
Teatard Pique – renaming of Macaroni and Cheese
GI Pique – renaming of Purple Heart
Economists’ Pique – renaming of Razzmatazz
Wall Street Pique – renaming of Screamin’ Green
Anymore Piques to add to help the kids color our economic, social, and political valley?
That's what Intensedebate is measuring–your Pique Score!
President McCain sent Vice-President Palin to the Hill today to soothe…
No P for you!
I had to negotiate with a hostage taker. However, I knew SWAT was gathering outside and would beat him for making me listen to his crazy shit for the 3 h, 22 m it took them to put their cammies on and get over there. First Rule: Hostage takers are incredibly selfish assholes who are unable to see anything outside their own little world. You've got to try to get them to open up to the possibility that the people they're about to kill have some value.____Obama needs to uphold his own values as well as the values of the people who elected him. He needs to make the Republican hostage takers open up to the idea that other people might have some value. And if that doesn't work, to pound the shit out of them until they drop their weapons. ____Compromise is part of the President's job, but that assumes the people you're negotiating with really have the nation's best interests at heart. There is massive evidence that R's are only in it for themselves and their rich friends. They resent paying ANY taxes. The D's have much more in common with the R's, socio-economically, than they do with the folks that are harmed by their constantly giving in.
Somewhere out there are a bunch of social-darwinist conservative wingnuts who are super-pissed that the government is extending unemployment benefits.
You must mean Michele Bachmann, and yes, she's already complaining about extending UE benefits.
And she got to the lying part right away.
Spend all that money on UE benefits may cut into her farm subsidies.
And they won today.
23% X 300 million = 69 million wingnutfucks
Yes, and it was inevitable, no matter what that they would be complaining. So why not please your own base. At least then you please somebody.
I'm pleased that benefits got extended and 98% of the country didn't get a tax hike. We can kill the tax cuts in 2012 when the average American is actually paying attention to the game.
Long story short, Barry wasn't willing to use the unemployed as a pawn in the game to get the rich to start paying their taxes. I understand this. Can't say as I agree with it, because at some point you have to say no to the Republicans and and their deficit-generating ways. But he wasn't willing to cut them lose to win this thing.
I will look forward to further Democratic defeats when Republicans start claiming they saved the unemployed in their ads.
OK, my unemployment benefits ($265/week–yay!) run out next week, so I have mixed emotions here. It is not pleasant being one of the hostages. And I do like being able to eat. Having said that, we still got screwed.
Here's a bet: Those assholes across the aisle–and the assholes on this side of the aisle–still aren't going to repeal Don't Ask Don't Tell and probably aren't going to pass START, either. Certainly not before the next Congress, so the GOP can claim sanity was their idea.
Here's another bet: That tax cut for the top 2 or 3% ain't gonna be rolled back in 2012. LBJ said it: You dance with them what brung ya. And big, big money and greasy corporate grift bought this last election and they'll buy the next one, too. And the Teatards are so fucking stupid they think taxes are worse than having no railroads, crumbling roads and bridges and a sectarian school system.
We had one chance, and once single-payer healthcare went out the window and the stimulus program was pinched to starvation wages, that chance was dead, dead, dead. Because Obama's army said, why fight for fake change? And did not vote in 2010, probably won't vote in 2012.
But hey, I'll get my $265 until somebody, somewhere starts hiring. Whoopity shit.
Correct me if I'm wrong but the unemployment extension is for one year. And the tax cuts are for two years?
I understand compromise but this sounds like Jack just traded his cow for a handful of "magic" beans.
Yeah, that pretty much sums up how I feel. Compromise, blah blah, is not the same as capitulation, and this capitulation is a slap in the face to all those progressive groups who worked their asses off to support Obama and to hold what they could in the last election. There's just no other way to define it.
This country was founded on compromise
So what is this, the Misery Compromise? How does this help? It's almost another trillion dollars in deficit spending that the damn Republicans demanded, right after they got elected by promising to cut the deficit. Who the hell is going to pay for this 700 billion in tax breaks for the wealthiest Americans? If Social Security, Medicare, and Defense are off the table, it's going to come out of public education, government subsidies, and everything else that lets the middle class make ends meet, barely. Either way, we're all fucked, but now, thanks to the worst negotiation since the Canarsies sold Manhattan, the Republicans get to blame the Democrats for all the shit and take credit for lowering taxes.
Anyway I wrote my Senator and I'm gonna write my Representative. And suggest all Wonketteers do the same. Except Neilist, 'cause he's Neilist, and Limey Lizzy, 'cause, well, you know, I'm not a racist, but clearly she's an illegal.
I am so getting my citizenship this year….
My senators are McCain and Kyl. Seriously, I don't think they read and even if they did, knowing how pissed off I am would just give them a perverse thrill.
Yeah…I had to suspend my cynicism to write my Senator. And to suggest that anyone else do it. But it made me feel better, especially since it's the only way to (marginally, at best) productively vent my rage.
My representative is Boner so I think my cries fall on deaf orange ears.
Where's the alcohol?
Pissed Obama has evolved out of Emo Obama in the month after the midterm elections, and Pissed Obama does not care what Campaign Obama used to say about things.
Change … has come to Barack Obama?
Sad face.
Barack needs to try this speech out.
http://maxspeaksout.ytmnd.com/
I seem to remember another Democratic president who had a problem with hostages, and that did not turn out well…
Mitch McConnell says he wants to do everything he can to ensure that Obama is a one-term President?
I think Obama is looking to beat him to the punch.
He wants to make sure we have a "North Star" out there? So Sarah Palin is all his fault? Well, that pisses me off more than this latest capitulation…
This will not be a popular comment, but here goes:
What did you people want him to do, exactly? His majority in Congress has shown him again and again that they will fragment and dither just enough to allow the bad guys to stall things indefinitely. And the only consequential power he has over the process, really, is the veto. So with the lame-duck congress hobbling it's way to the finish line, the only chance he had of advancing the agenda was to make this shitty, shitty deal. What was he supposed to do? Veto unemployment insurance extension? That's an electoral winner right there! Give up on the slight chance he has of getting some stuff done while he still has a majority? That has success written all over it too.
People get to put some food on the table because of this. If you have to blame anyone, blame the Republitards and the blue dogs for choosing their shitty tax cut cargo-cult over the well-being of the country, not the guy trying, under fire from both sides of the spectrum, to do the best he can in a terrible climate.
I've said it elsewhere, but he's the president, not Santa Claus. This is how the sausage gets made, folks.
Most of us are still in stage two. Give 'em time.
Mr. Catt, you aren't very funny today, but you are wise.
Let's face it, I'm never THAT funny.
Second that. The recovery seems pretty shaky and this does provide some 'stimulus' at least from the extended unemployment even if we forget the human side on that. Next year there is going to be some serious come to jeebus meetings about where the states and municipal governments are and that won't be pretty either. The debt is a nightmare, but the very real risk of a double dip by taking the high road probably was not worth it. That said I've heard nothing about Barry pushing very hard to the START treaty or DADT in this deal. I know we aren't supposed to mix metaphors, but why couldn't those have been included?
yeah you're probably right about most of that, but I think the thing most are upset about is that we wanted a Pres who, when faced with the blatant uber-douchery of the Repugnant Party, would take some big swings at those fuckers with those big black fists of his and actually USE the bully pulpit to to force them to do what 2/3 of REAL 'Merkans wanted…instead we get this bullshit and we all haz a sad/ angry face right now (except for a handful of rich fuckers.) gawd I hate this country sometimes…Canuckistan looks better all the time!
Sorry Tomm, normally I'm with you, but not this time. Our commander has shown way too much willingness to show his hand before the betting begins. He started at "compromise" on so many important issues over the last two years, he left himself no room to negotiate. And his weakness on the bully pulpit makes Harry Reid look like a heavy-weight titleist. And if that's the sausage being served, I may opt for the tofu bacon instead.
Barry's choice, in this particular case, was cut the unemployed loose to get the taxes paid. He wasn't ready to do that. He protected the folks who needed it most.
We've got to stop these Repub thugs somewhere, somehow. We're talking about Bush's messes here: the wars, the tax cuts, the polarizing politics. Of course, that is their strategy. They want us to feel compassion for the unemployed and the poor. To use our compassion against us while they get their prized goal. We, even here on Wonkette, are divided. And we have to sort out the problems THEY created. Argghhh.
Agreed, and I must confess, in my relief at not not having to plan to start living in my car in another couple of weeks,* I kind of forgot to be unalterably pissed at Barry for caving on the tax thing. I guess that we poors are a lot like the millionaires after all, reverting to "I'm all right, Jack," only over slightly different amounts of Federal swag.
*At least, it looks like the UE extension will actually pass…god knows my OWN FUCKING SENATOR objects to it…
I'm not questioning that. My beef is that he failed to take the lead that the opposition handed him on a silver platter many months ago. He started his little girl whining about a month ago. Where was the lion's roar when it would have had the most effect? Opportunity to roast the bastards on their own coals, wasted. that said, I'm glad the people I was forced to lay off so long ago, can count on a check for the near future. No snark. Just really disgusted.
Compromise isn't giving up shit before the Republithugs even ask for it, in the forlorn hope it will get him on their good side and they'll play fair. Let's hope they shut down the government, and some scooter buys get sucked into the non-functioning Medicare program because no one's at work to approve their freebies and the fat fuck have to get off their asses and walk to the cupboard to get another bag of Fritos.
If you have to blame anyone, blame the Republitards and the blue dogs
I'd prefer to see Obama doing more of that, mostly the Blue Dogs.
If anything, his majority in Congress has been the only thing responsible for accomplishing the one good thing O can (and will) claim: health insurance. And you have Nancy Pelosi to thank for that, not Obama. If you left it up to Obama, you would have had yet another "sorry, not my fault" speech, and you would have said "hey look what he's got to work with."
The Republicans are bullies. If you stand up to them, standing up to them in the future gets easier, not harder. Now he will have to trade something else away to protect Social Security.
They're sharks. You don't negotiate with a shark once it tastes blood in the water.
OK. You know what I want him to do. Stand up at the podium and say "fuck you" to all these Republican assholes. Grow a fucking Afro and act like Tommy Smith. Just make a fucking stand.
What did I want him to do, exactly?
Let the all the tax cuts expire, if necessary. Let the estate tax revert to its 2001(?) rules. Repeatedly introduce bills to extend UI and, maybe the 2% payroll tax "holiday" (which might actually have some stimulative effect). BTW, there is no UI extension for him to veto, but he could make the Republicans have to vote against it. Make some fucking noise about the fact that the House already passed an extension of tax cuts for the lower 98%, and the Republicans killed it in the Senate.
Now, this approach would have some real costs, to be sure, the biggest of which would be a lot more folks running out of UI. But, you know, there are already a lot of un-, under-, marginally-, and self-employed people who don't receive unemployment benefits now, and who won't start receiving them because of this extension.
I am not in favor of causing hardship to my fellow citizens, but part of the "sausage-making" process is leverage, and perception of leverage., and sometimes open conflict is a better long-term strategy than pain-avoidance.
BTW, I do blame the Refucks for this bullshit, but as a lifelong Democratic voter (and, yes, I did vote last month), I don't matter to them. In a representative democracy, I expect my party's leadership to fight the sausage-making battle (metaphor fail, I know) on my behalf.
Now, I am not so solipsistic as to expect that the Democratic leadership is going to always follow my exact wishes 100% (or even 50%, since I'm pretty far on the Democratic side of the party). But, as yet, I still have the right to hold, and express, opinions about what they actually do. (It's obvious from just this thread that we've all got assholes and opinions).
In this case, to use the President's own metaphor, I think he's made a huge political mistake by negotiating a deal with hostage-takers, and that the long-term consequences of that political mistake will outweigh the short-term benefits of the deal. It's my opinion. YMMV.
I do have to say that I'm a little miffed at being described (indirectly) as "sanctimonious" by my party's President, because I happen to disagree with him. I can get called names by Republicans any day of the week.
"This is how the sausage gets made, folks."
Now kitchen cats and Democrats will never more be seen
They`ll all be ground to sausage meat in Dunderbeck`s machine.
Good post…extra pee points for you.
No, this is not the only deal he could have made, the veto is not the only power he has. As commander-in-chief of the army, he could end Don't Ask, Don't Tell with a statement. He could also open up an investigation into all crimes committed during the Bush administration. Then, he would have something with which to bargain with Republicans.
Lighten up you bunch o' damn Francises, this is round one. Let the Republicans put their PAC money where their lie-holes is and deliver the budget cutting they promised. The True Faithful think the Depts. of Energy, Agriculture & Education will be extinct next year and by 'cutting waste and fraud' all will be well with Medicare, tee, hee. You ain't seen disappointed and pissed until you've seen mobs of teabaggers run riot, torching Rascals and frothing at the mouth about the free fucking market…
tee hee, at least that image made me smile, would LOVE to see me some Rascals burnin' in the streets (preferably while still occupied!)
I do love the Francis reference.
"Call me Francis again, I'll kill ya."
Nah-uh…he can't be mad at me. I called it. You all heard how mad at him I was this morning. I was mad at him first. Got dibs.
**sniff sniff** You got one term stink on you homey.
Oooh oh. The phrase that dare not speak it's name. And you done spoke it. Oh, oh.
"That's not cynical," I said. "That's pure, nut cutting politics…and I advise you stay out of it; you're too sensitive." — Hunter S. Thompson –
Congressional Progressive Caucus:
Just 1 percent of that $700 billion would pay for almost 142,000 elementary school teachers for an entire year. That money should be used to create jobs, rebuild our infrastructure and educate our children, not for the wealthy to buy more yachts.
How many yacht-jobs is that, CPC? Can we afford to lose those yacht-jobs to the CHINESE? No, I didn't think so.
And think of the trade inbalance, as rich people use their extra million to buy more Ming vases. Jobs for auctioneers are Sotheby's? Is that what the Republithugs call a job program?
Did Obama compromise on tax cuts to stop Southern states from seceding?!?
Fuuuuck….Things are going to get much, much worse before they get better, aren't they.
Horribly worse. Back to the Supremes–this whole shitstorm is a result of Ralph Nader's vote in Florida that made the state as tight as it was in 2000 prez race and then the much-adored Sandra Day O'Connor for casting the deciding vote to make that Dickfaced Bush president.
Fuck you, Ms O'Connor and Ralph "There won't be that much difference between Bush's Supreme Court picks and those of Gore" Nader. Fuck you both. You gave this shit. I wish it were the two of you wallowing in it,
Oh, and a mention to Bill Clinton. Knowing Ken Starr was on a step stool, peeking in the bathroom windows of the West Wing, that horny egotist had to get a blow job and fuck the Democrats in the next election while he was at it.
I blame a lot of people for the mess we're in now. Especially those three, because this is all George Bush's shit we're living with.
No, you're begging the question. Things are not going to get better, ever.
ROARRRRR!
Moar like rawr…
rawr?
DOESN'T LOOK AND SOUND AS IMPRESSIVE AS IT DOES IN ALLCAPS!!1!!!!
I know KO isn't well regarded here. But, but it's all we got folks.
Fuck you Barry. My money's mad at you. Not another penny for you and your next slight-of-hand campaign, dude. Nuh uh. I won't bother reiterating the litany of cave-ins you've provided us in the last two years. See ya later, chickenshit.
You shouldn't ever give these fuckers money. It only encourages them.
Bitchin, I did something I only do on "big news" days, like (snark), and (snark), I checked out the "real" news comments all over the place.The one that really stuck in my craw was on Gawker Jims post about this. A commenter made the same assertion – no mo money for you. It was the response that got me. someone said a. "he's really going to miss your $10", and b. "I plan on donating $4000 to Hopey in 2012 because I'm going to make a fortune in the market the next two years and I would like four more. Of course, they made grammatical errors. p.s. check out the internets Bossy Bear Sullivan on this http://andrewsullivan.theatlantic.com/.
I know my contributions pale in comparison to the corporate zillions headed his way, but damned if withholding it doesn't make me feel like a powerbroker/kingmaker.
Well, only Republicans pay people to shit on them.
Hmmmm……I remember in high school they used to nominate some poor plain-looking girl as prom queen just so they can make fun of her when she won. And then they would wonder why the girl got angry.
Then came the pig blood…
Hillary does have a slight resemblance to Amy Irving so…..maybe.
Sissy Spacek, darling…
Noooo…..I meant Amy Irving. Barry is in the starring role originally filled by Miss Spacek.
The American public all seem to want tax cuts, but then get pissed off when you won't buy them their Rascal scooters. The republicans are assholes who when you look at the facts have deficit spent since that asshole Regan was president. They keep telling people you can have it all and not pay for it. The media is full of assholes busy yelling about Lindsey getting sent to jail and losing her role as Linda Lovelace (A role she has been training for diligently) and don't cover anything of substance.
So here we are Fox News lying their asses off everyday, allowing the dickish republicans to cut off funding for poor working people while making sure their old people base is covered for drugs and hospital stays. Talking about taking away health care for the working poor and those who have been laid off because their jobs were sent to China, with the encouragement of the owners of the republican party. And this ass clown is telling me I am holding him to an ideal. Yep time for drinks.
What evs, Barry. The GOP agreeing to extend unemployment benefits is a blatant admission that tax cuts do not create jobs.
So Hopey is pissed at me? Get in line, Barry. My wife gets pissed when I don't shut the towel cabinet door. The lazy shits at work are pissed at me 'cause I work too hard and the rigid fucks there are pissed because I don't do it their way. One dog is pissed because I just took him out for a walk in the cold and the other is pissed because his walk in the cold was too short. My kid is a teenager and is pissed in general, I just get caught in the stream. So join the crowd, Mr. President, we're one big, pissed off family.
Honey (Barry), I know you had a bad day at work, but you really shouldn’t take it out on the kids (Dems).
Some yogurt will help with your vaginal infection, Mr. President.
Just for yucks, I checked Twitter's progressive universe because the kids are all doing it and they are mad at Obama for being mad at them. They are noticing the only time he gets it up now-a-days is when he is telling liberals to go to hell, not so much the republicans. There are calls of resignation, impeachment, and a progressive movement. You also get the observation that this doesn't quite fit with the "Si, Se Puede" or "Yes, We Can" video. We are pissed off.
Then the soon to be Speaker Boner is now meeting with Operation Rescue's Randall Terry. Yeah. Then there is that.
Screw all the depressing news today. I'm popping in Ingmar Bergman's Winter Light for a little cheering up.
I won't worry until Hopey hires Dick Morris.
Haha. You forgot the "in 3…….2……..1…….", dincha?
We just got our tuxedo-kitty, Rocky, neutered. So my better-half comes home and coos, "Who's black and white and has no balls?" I go, "Rocky!" And he says, "No, that's not who I meant.
Very nice!
Your better-half sounds like a scooter-rider.
At least he didn't sign a free-trade agreement with Mexico, gut welfare, and deregulate the telecommunications and financial industries so there'd be huge busts in both years down the road.
As I understand this tax stuff as taught by the Republicans, cutting taxes on the wealthy creates jobs for the peons. So, wouldn't it make more sense to enact a tax code that has lower tax rates the more money you make? That would encourage all those rich people to hire more peons with all those extra bucks they have because of those low, low tax rates at the highest income levels. And, it would encourage all those peons to work that much harder to elevate themselves to tax rates that are lower and lower. In the process, you get those lowly peons to work harder thereby increasing their productivity. I really should have been an economist. Or a fascist. Or something.
Economics works exactly like that.
Now, if only the real world did.
Via Nancy Pelosi's facebook page.
Oh, my. Parker Bros. is going to have to sue Pelosi?
Word. Those college students killed themselves (canvassing) for nothing. Who's gonna do it in 2012? Not fucking me, for fuck's sake.
Okay, cool. Now where are all those jobs the Republicans keep telling us result from such low, low tax rates?
I think I've finally decoded the Rosetta Stone for the O man.
I believe that his best exit strategy is to pull an LBJ. What do I mean by that?
LBJ said this in 1968: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DeFOHbdP6RA&fe...
The O man should and I believe, may very well be considering not running for re-election. It gives him perfect cover to say the following:
"I believe that my opponents have used my race to make my presidency ineffective and thereby sabotage it. They have divided the country by causing those in this country who cannot accept having a black man as president, to turn against the common cause of our country. They have stirred up the opposition of others who cannot admit, but do believe deep down, that they also cannot accept having a black man as president. This has caused the executive branch of the government to have become weakened in its constitutional role. I therefore, shall not seek and I will not accept the nomination of my party for another term as your president."
Now, before you get all down on his choosing that approach, let me explain what I consider to be the considerable logic behind this.
Hmm…soooo, we can follow up with RFK getting shot and Hubert Humphrey losing to Nixon?
The O man in the past has praised Ronald Reagan for being a "transformational" president. When he did so, while not admitting that he agreed with any aspect of the Reagan transformation, he seemed to be almost declaring that he also wanted to be a transformational president. To date, he has been nothing of the sort. But if he chooses not to run for president, in the last two years of his presidency he can become that "transformational" president to which he aspired. Now. How does he do that? Here are some examples.
He can turn to the Republicans and say, "Okay. You fuckers wanna shut down the government if you don't get your tax cuts and the rest of your agenda passed when you only control 1/2 of 1/3 of the branches of the government? Fine. Let's do it. Shut that fucking government down. And when the chaos ensues, and I have to declare a State of Emergency and martial law and exercise all those wonderful powers you gave the president under the Patriot Act, I'm gonna do so. And, when I do, I'm gonna be that black muslim devil that you fuckers falsely portrayed me to be. You want that? Don't tempt me."
He can say, "You fuckers want to extend the Bush Tax Cuts permanently? Go right the fuck ahead. Put that non-veto proof bill on my desk and I'll continue to veto the mother-fucker until I've signed my name on the veto so many fucking times, the words, 'Barack Obama' are going to be permanently ground into the desktop in the Oval Office. Meantime, all the while, you bastards are going to be paying much, much higher taxes."
He can end both fucking military misadventures with a stroke of the pen. "Bring 'em home. Signed, Barack Obama."
He can shut down Guantanamo. "Signed, Barack Obama."
He can end DADT. "Signed, Barry O."
He can authorize Eric Holder to start prosecuting the banking thieves and the war criminals.
Talk about transformational.
And such a tactic is not destructive to the Democratic Party's chances of still retaining the White House in 2012. Why, you say? Here's why. Who is the logical heiress apparent to the White House if the O Man pulls an LBJ? Why, it's Hillary, of course. And, Hillary is no slouch whatsoever. By having stayed ensconced in the Ivory Tower of the State Department, Hillary has pretty much been shielded and is immune to what's been going on (or not going on) in Congress and the White House for the last few years. Further, Hillary is a heroine to the likes of Sarah Palin and Xtine O'Donnell. Both have said things close to, "I'd vote for her." Now, if what they mean by that is, "I'd vote for her, because she's a woman," then for the millions and millions of female Sarah Palin and Xtine O'Donnell acolytes out there who are salivating at the prospect of their first woman president, (now that we've had the first Black president,) they're going to vote for her by the score whether those votes come from the "Mama Grizzlies" out there or from the "Code Pink"ers. If Xtine and Sarah, though, are saying, "I'd vote for her because she would guarantee that the ruling elite remain in power," then maybe not so much, but that's not going to change the result: Hillary Landslide. Ya think the wimmin folk are going to vote en masse for Mitt Romney? Mike Huckabee? No fucking way.
Then, in retirement, the O Man can become the next "Jimmy Carter," one of the most effective ex-presidents on the scene nowadays. Except, the O Man can become Jimmy Carter X 10, because he can constantly be out on the scene talking about the deplorable state of race relations in this country, the need to dismantle the military/industrial complex, and the need to properly restore the American Middle Class, the working people of this country, to what they used to have. And the O Man can do all of that effectively, because "He Gives Good Speech."
So, I say, Barry, hand that exploding cigar off to somebody before it blows up in your hand.
Am I too much of a dreamer here?
He has totally missed the meaning of Massachusetts, and the 2010 midterms. The progressive electorate didn't come out. He's looking for what? Swing voters? Moderate Republicans? The progressive electorate won't come out again in 2012.
He's a one term president anyway. He might as well be a one term president with half term balls.
And yes, we are dreamers.
I don't know why he even worries about a second term, because honestly, he had to have known regardless of how the economy was that him being black is a wildcard totally out of his control and that he could be a one term president regardless of the facts on the ground.
Given this, I'd have governed like a one-termer from the beginnning. He's NEVER had any wiggle room for error, yet he still seems to sillilly believe that he does. He should have known the second the birth certificate shit didn't die down, and ESPECIALLY after those that believed he was a Muslim or still didn't know his faith actually ROSE earlier this year, that his hold on the presidency was tenuous at best.
This fucker needs to rule like there is no tomorrow. We have been on the brink of meltdown and disaster for a few years now; we elected him to rule boldly. There isn't any other option. What he's doing, now, won't just ensure him of one term, it'll ensure that he's a near worthless president.
You reason with insanity at your own risk. He keeps this up, and not only are his chances fucked, but we're fucked as a nation.
Total dreamer. I think Barry's just too nice to do the hard-hitting part – which would be necessary for him to be transformational and not just a hapless one-termer.
This is the Obama Fan Fiction Thread? I was looking for the Obama Cheap Psychoanalysis Thread. Where is that?
http://www.psychologytoday.com/
He had his foot on the necks of the Republiklan Party, the day after his inaguration. He let them up, when he should have stepped down and deliver the coup de gras.
This is George Bush's world. His administration and the evil Dick fucked up everything so completely, unfucking it is hopeless. I wish that fucker McCain had won–a Republican deserves the mess they've made of this country, nay, this world.
I'm reading The Nine, Jeffrey Toobin's book about the Supremes, which is largely about the ground work done by the conservatards to take over the court.
Christ, but I hate those dirty fuckers. I hate them so much, I just wish I could bring myself to type something worse than fucker.
This could be the bluest we've seen you in a long time, DBB. FWIW, I think it's warranted, but as an antidote, I'm beginning the "who can we run against him in '12" mind exercise. It helps. Try it.
May I suggest:
" Legacy of Ashes, the History of the CIA" by Tim Weiner.
Just to consolidate your mood.
I feel like a dipshit. Was anybody thinking that Ali was executing a winning strategy when he kept letting George Foreman beat the shit out of him all those early rounds? Call me a hopeless romantic, but I'm still holding out for Barry actually carrying out a winning (for America) strategy.
The only problem with that theory is that Ali had actually won some fights before the Foreman bout.
He can win elections, his legislative agenda has been thwarted by an incompetent/corrupt Congress. As you can tell, I still have hope for him, silly me.
When did this site turn into Firedoglake?
No kidding, I have barely visited my beloved Wonkette lately because of it.
I think there is a big difference between "this is lame and part of a disturbing trend of capitulation" and "OMG, IM VOTING FOR MCCAIN BECAUSE HILARY DIDNT BEAT THE NEGRO!!!!!111!.
Don't know about that, I've seen a couple of "Hillary wouldn't have done this" comments on this thread.
I think this crap would be being done even more often and to a worse level under a Clinton "triangulation, part two".
I feel both optimism(Barry Luv) and pessimism(Damn you Barry). I lean toward optimism with the idea of Barry the strategist who builds on an idea slowly and patiently while giving his opponents enough rope with which to hang themselves. We will see.
I like that Wonketteerz are not all on the same page here and are capable of understanding and feeling more than one viewpoint on this. Probably not the same story at Kos or Salonz. For those who are super-dismayed right now, I am also too. I haven't COMPLETELY given up however. Could just be the beer(pronounced burr).
Riot in the House!
You know, Mr. President, you could have gotten on top of this, oh, fuckin' months ago. You know, do shit like say "sure you can have billionaire tax cuts…now show America how you plan to pay for it, since you're deficit hawks, and all." A compromise would have been to demand that, and then find a way to pay for the unemployment benefits. THAT's a fuckin' compromise, you epic fraudster.
How about "make me do it" instead offering to do the Republicans work for them before they even ask you to? How about that?
You're mad, huh? We're mad, too. The difference is that we can't do a goddamned thing about it, being one paycheck from living in the streets, and all. Don't worry, we won't be crying for your pain. Crying takes up too much energy for us living on a diet of hobo beans. My brother's unemployment ran out months ago, and he had to move back in with the mom, but he's living. Instead of bribing the helpless with unemployment benefits, why don't you direct that anger towards getting the banks loaning again?
Why don't you show half the anger you do bitch-slapping who sweat and bled for you towards your actual enemies? You know the ones that hate your guts, but you're still chasing them around hoping for their love? You're fuckin' pitiful.
Thank you.
At the risk of losing my precious, precious pee points, I’m going to rant.
It's like someone said during the healthcare debate: Obama can promise whatever he wants but shit doesn't pass the Senate unless Ben Nelson likes it. Our system is set up in such a way as to let one viewpoint have a disproportionate influence in the legislature. And the conservatives currently fucking everything up are just too ideologically rigid to change their minds, no matter how much evidence you put in front of them that their ideas do not work.
Just last week the Senate Repubs sent Obama a letter, signed by all 42 members of the caucus, stating in no uncertain terms that they would not work on any other piece of business until he agreed to extend the tax cuts for everyone, including the millionaires. So what if 2/3 of the people polled say they want the tax cuts to expire? The votes just weren’t there. And if they are not there now, it's for damn sure they won't be there next month when there are even more Repukes to deal with.
Barry knows this is bad policy. During the debate over the stimulus in early ’09 the Repubs said the entire package should be tax cuts. Barry told them he was not interested in past ideas that were proven failures. But tax cuts are the only policy idea the Repubs have. It’s all they care about. If Barry hasn’t made them see that they are wrong by now, he certainly wasn’t going to do it in the next two weeks. So he threw them a large chunk of red meat in order to use the other half of the carcass to get some things for the little people (extended UI, education tax credits) on the theory that half the carcass was better than nothing at all. Of course he could have refused to do anything and gone with the whole “Repubs are holding us hostage over tax cuts for millionaires” line, but so what? What’s that populist anger going to get channeled into? The next election is two years away. People need help now.
And it’s not as if we didn’t know this debate was coming. Those tax cuts have had a rollback date since the day they were enacted. But as someone noted elsewhere on this thread, Obama’s Army stayed home this fall. Barry implored us to get out and vote. He said this election is important and it is inexcusable to sit it out. But people, many of us sat it out. And now the conservatives think they have all the momentum. And maybe Barry thinks so as well. Why wouldn’t he? As much trouble as he’s had getting anything done for two years, we’ve now made it harder for him to accomplish anything while sitting around complaining about how he’s not accomplishing anything. Fuck me, no wonder he’s pissed.
It's as if we put Houdini in a straitjacket and chains and then, just before cinching the canvas bag shut and tossing it in the river, we sliced his aorta to make it a little more challenging for him.
Obama said repeatedly in ’08 that change would not come overnight, or even in one election. We have to lay the groundwork, we have to keep proving over and over and over and over again that our ideas are better.
And yet people are in a snit because change didn’t happen after one election. But the things Obama agreed to today are going to help a lot of people. Today was a draw. Tomorrow when we finish pouting, we try again.
Now go ahead and thumb me down, ya bastards.
Well don't look like you got total keel-hauled on the good ship Pique-Wad. Here's one thumbs up ta bring ya back to +1.
Problem is, he didn't even try. Problem is, he turned out to be the elite's little hand-puppet. And now, we're onto that. C'mon Mr. President, either become a "transformational" President or go down in history as just another Millard Fillmore.
Another problem with this deal is tyhis: It raises taxes on the poorest Americans. How, you ask? It exchanges the 'Make Work Pay' tax cut for the poor with the 2% drop in payroll taxes. This effectively raises the tax rate since the 2% does not equal the make work pay tax cut.
I don't know about that. The MWP credit is worth 6.2% of income, which I think is the same percentage of SS withheld, but MWP for an individual has a maximum of $400. The deal drops the SS withholding to 4.2%, but there is not a point beyond which you don't get it. So if you make $20,000 in 2011 and you apply the MWP credit on your return (in early 2012) it's worth 2% towards calculating the tax you owe. Whereas the SS deal gives you 2% more in every paycheck throughout 2011, which is about $400 a year on that $20,000 income and which you will spend, thus maybe stimulating the economy a tiny bit. And if you make $40,000 per year it's worth $800 over the next year. Plus some other credits that were set to expire after 2010 stay on for another two years.
The big screwing on this deal besides the continued low tax bracket for the wealthy is the estate tax reduction. That's worth a lot more to the US treasury. Unfortunately it's also the only thing the conservatives cared about and they were willing to hold up every other piece of legislative business to get it. Come January, the House might very well have put everything else on the back burner to push on reinstating the cuts (possibly even making them bigger) and the Repubs in the Senate might very well have used their procedural blackmail techniques to force a vote on the issue as well. And who knows if some of these credits would have been put back in then? As bad as this deal might feel, I contend that the screwing the lower classes would get after January would be even worse.
Honest, I follow your arguments, and I even agree that the the short-term benefits of the deal are substantial and slightly stimulative (I say slightly because tax cuts — even on SS — are much less stimulative than the gummint actually spending money on goods and services; you may recall this discussion from the "stimulus" bill).
Nevertheless, I regard the deal as a rather big mistake, because Obama has essentially conceded control of the political frame. I believe this will render his second term substantively irrelevant, and set the stage for "attacking the deficit" by attacking Social Security and Medicare. I appreciate the President's desire to provide some short-term relief to some of those who really need it, but I still believe that the long-term cost of the deal will be onerous. Deals with the devil are notoriously tricky.
Regarding January, et. seq., for the next two years, Bamz will still hold the veto pen. I'm thinking that he could have gotten more bang per bill by splaining to Boner that every R-desired measure must include a bunch of goodies for the small people, or else phhht.
Obviously, you and I disagree on this. At the risk of incorrectly reading your mind, it sounds like you believe the path to a better future is through superior governance, based on progressive ideals, and incremental progress (where, one hopes, some of the increments are large ones).
I'm very familiar with this view, as it's still my core belief. However, watching politics since 1968 has caused me to realize that a pretty large fraction of the US electorate (including, but definitely not limited to, wingnuts) don't have two clues to rub together about what's actually going on in the political world; and, in fact, they have no interest in finding out. The vast majority of US elections are decided by voters who have enthusiasm but not much accurate knowledge. Instead of knowledge, they have memes. The politicians who are most effective at implanting favorable-to-them memes are the ones who will get elected, and who will then have a chance to govern.
Since 1968, the Republicans have understood this, and in the '80s they basically made it the central tenet of their party: Truth doesn't matter, nor do accomplishments. What matters is repeating the same concepts over and over and over, in every public venue. If the concepts happen to contradict reality, fluff around it. Reality is wrong.
Now, I do not suggest that the Democratic Party should adopt this approach wholesale (although, of course, they already have done so at the retail level). But, if the Dems don't resist vigorously Republican efforts to establish or reinforce memes, they are setting themselves up for continued electoral weakness. And if you can't get elected, you have no ability to practice enlightened governance.
If Democratic electoral success is confined to those occasions where the incumbent Republicans have fucked up so badly for so long that a spontaneous anti-R meme arises, we will simply continue to ratchet downward.
BTW, I hope I'm wrong about all this.
Cheers.
Don't disagree with any of your points. When I wrote that the other night it was late, I'd been catching up on the day's news, and I was just pissed off about the ire being directed Obama's way because I think it's misdirected. We have a fucked-up system with some nasty constraints. That's the bigger culprit.
I also think much of the ire in fact comes from slavish devotion to a meme, namely the one about rich people have money and so should pay a higher percentage of income tax. Which indicates that Dems can sell some memes pretty hard, at least. And when reality intrudes on that meme–in this case the Dems fucked up royally by not decoupling the cuts from each other in September, the votes are not there in the Senate now and they have no leverage so Obama tried to salvage something out of the mess–the pissed-off-ness on the left can be as intense as it is on the right.
I agree 100% on raising taxes and I bet in his heart Obama does too (he even said at the press conference that he thinks these cuts are bad policy.) But if he hadn't made this deal he'd still have his base pissed at him for letting the cuts on the under-$250k crowd expire. So it was really a no-win situation for him and I wish people would have recognized that and spent their energy figuring out what to do next instead of name-calling and muttering about a primary challenge in 18 months. The Repukes can do a lot of damage in that time while we're all pissing ourselves.
Looks like Obama got more than just unemployment benefits extensions…Ezra is right in that GOP is taking a victory lap when in fact they just agreed to lots of things that will now increase the deficit, which they pretended to be worried about last week.
I for one am not mad at our president. I am mad at the idiots who put more Republicans in office and made Boner the Speaker.
Who cares what they agreed to that they don't really like? They don't have to own it, because our leader slipped it in. They don't get punished for running up the deficit. We do. Politically, this is a massive, massive loss. Financially, we're continuing to bust the deficit with fake stimuli.
Hell, if we're going to see a stimulus and if we're going to add to the deficit and debt, it sure as hell better be something we can see and something that ACTUALLY creates jobs.
Do you actually think for one minute that this little nuance about the GOP voting for things that will increase the deficit is actually going to make those morons in the tea party and the dittoheads think twice about voting for the GOP in 2012 again? Not a fucking chance.
The Social Security tax stuff is what worries me. Repugs have their eye on killing SS and their long-game is infinitely better. They can afford to take some short-term pain if it means whacking Social Security long-term.
Well, I'm told that as a federal employee I won't be getting any pay raises for the next two years, which is kind of a drag but hey, I'm willing to make a little sacrifice. But I am so relieved that the rich guys are going to be able to keep using hundred dollar bills to light their cigars instead of having to go downscale with fifties, and the rich dames are going to be able to continue using Dom Perignon 1992 for their daily douche instead of having to settle for Korbel or Cold Duck. Thanks for rolling over, Obie!
I'll trade you the 10% pay cut everyone in my company agreed to last year for your pay freeze. . .
Wingnuts are now furious that the unemployment benneis are going to be extended and are not going to vote for this thing anyway. It helps poor people too much. Let them all expire. (tax cuts AND wingnuts).
Sorry, Barry, you're us. And we are not witches. Well, most of us.
Shit. This really IS great news for John McCain.
Yep, you can tell the man knows damn well he just got caught taking a shit in the kitchen sink, but he's still going to try to blame the housemaid anyway. Dumb move. Never mind the inevitable butthurt from DFHs or MSNBC – I hear some House members want to re-enact the ending of the War Of 1812. Sure hope Biden was wearing a heavy-duty cup today.
Someone really needs to lose his whole "Oh God I'll Do Whatever You Want, Just Please Don't Hit Me" negotiation technique – for the people he's dealing with, it just makes hitting him that much more fun.
Been thinking about this for a while. Fuck this idiot.
We do not negotiate with terrorists, we do not negotiate with terrorists, we do not negotiate with terrorists….we just give them whatever the hell they want. I'm not too sure, but doesn't compromise usually require that someone give up something? I don't think the GOP is giving anything they wouldn't have eventually given up. Oh well.
It's pretty sad when the Lunatic Fringe can dictate policy in this country. On Nov 2, 2010, the United States died due to stupidity.
Can I just say that some of the hysteria about "the deal" and these press conference clips is bordering on teatard crazy? Thanks to this post, and especially Olbermann's pompous and ridiculous Special Comment last night, I was expecting to see some kind of Sam Jackson lethal fire at every motherfucking progressive in the room. Instead, I heard Tim Duncan mildly protesting a foul with a referee, a lot of which actually made sense. And yet some people are acting like he just stabbed their wife and a waiter to death in the driveway. Congrats, Daily Kos, this is your "he's a muslin socialist!" moment! You must be proud.
Oh thank God for you Chet Kincaid, I am so glad that you exist. In fact I just read your comment of yesterday, about Barry's pragmatism and the hideous racism in the land, to Mr LimeyLizzie who is in LA. I think that means we had a trans-continental threeway.
Oh Lizzie, I am embarrassed at the high praise, and the fact that Mr. Limeylizzie knows I exist! But I am happy you dropped back in.
I guess you've got a job and everything is hunky dory in your world. It's easy to be pragmatic when you've got a paycheck. Many of those out there are well beyond even getting part of the UI benefits that have been authorized by this compromise. And they are the ones that are pissed, whether they are on the right or the left.
Let the food riots begin.
I'd multi-thumb you for that if I could. Everyone wants some big cathartic event so they can declare victory for one side and defeat for the other, and Obama just doesn't often view things through that prism. He's interested in getting shit done, not in politics or sticking it to the other guy just for the sake of doing so. Really, short term what would be accomplished by letting the tax cuts on the rich expire? Just a lot of shaking of fists and people on the left saying "Ha ha! Take that, conservatives!" Big whoop.
I want my $200 back!!
(I wonder if Hillary would've kicked their asses.)
At the end of the day Republicans can point to tax cuts for the wealthy and the estate tax, Dems can point to saving the unemployed, giving middle class tax relief to families, a payroll tax cut and a bunch of helpful tax credits. Im sorry, it may have been ugly, but that looks like a win to me.
Like it or not, while we were busy being outraged, the uppity negro quietly pulled a win out of his ass.
Zing-fuckin'-zing.
I know all the libtards are giving the republicans the omnipotence they imagined in Barry, but even so, they could not credibly run on that.
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