Ha ha, what?Here’s something to make you cry: While big liberal cities keep cutting commerce with Arizona over its terrifying “round up the brown folks” law, 59% of Americans “gave their overall approval to the law, which opponents charge is unconstitutional and a mandate for racial profiling.” (The actual Nazi party, under Hitler, went from 2.6% popular support before the Great Depression hit Germany to 43.6% by the third year of the financial catastrophe. So it’s a good thing we’re not in the midst of a terrible, nation-changing recession, right?)

If 59% sounds like an insane amount of support for Arizona’s anti-Mexican laws, here are some much worse percentages:

Seventy-three percent said they backed a measure requiring people to produce documents verifying their legal status if police ask for them, while 67% approve of allowing police to detain anyone who cannot verify that they are in the country legally.

[LA Times/LA Times]

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  • samsuncle

    Does this mean that 73% of Americans are for implanted micro-chips?

  • proudgrampa

    That is just plain depressing.

  • ManchuCandidate

    Well, at one point 70% of US Americans did believe that Iraq had something to do with 9-11 so I’m not really surprised. I would suspect that the majority of them didn’t understand what going into Iraq really meant and was gonna cost much like the majority who believe that law is even remotely fair or just.

    Understanding and understanding consequences isn’t really the US ‘mericun way.

  • Manos: Hands of Fate

    Well all those real muricans can start sending in their donations to herr Brewer keep their state afloat after everyone stops sending their conventions to Phoenix.

  • smitallica

    Arizona: It’s Not the Heat. It’s the Stupidity.

  • PsycGirl
  • Dashboard_Buddha

    [re=576362]smitallica[/re]: Awesome

  • Serolf Divad

    A 1958 Gallup poll showed that 96 percent of white Americans disapproved of interracial marriage.

    From: here.

    Lets face it: most Americans are bigots ’till they learn better.

  • JMP

    Depressing but not surprising. Hell, polls show that over half of Americans don’t fucking believe in evolution, absolutely verified fact, and are therefore too dumb to live; yet these people breed.

  • Doggin

    So… these polls of so called ‘Mrkins depend on people with land lines right? No one I know has one. Of course, we’re all big city East coast libruls, but still.

  • Geogre

    90% believe that they have their own birth certificates at hand.
    100% have never attempted to get their birth certificates.
    104% like answering pollsters.
    82.4% prefer answering questions about how they feel to how they think.
    16% heard about the law before they were asked about it.
    87% heard from someone who said that he knew all about the law, by an e-mail he got from his pastor’s groundskeeper, who said that all the Messicans were laughing at us.

    Let’s start telling pollster jokes.

  • Long Form Def Certificate

    If not for Santa Ana, just to let you know — where your feet are planted would be Mexico, correcto!

  • Gun-toting Progressive

    [re=576364]PsycGirl[/re]: Yeah, but the AZ government managed not to pass the “Fuck you, Feds; we’re keeping our incandescent light bulb” law.

  • TGY

    “I will not be pushed, filed, stamped, indexed, briefed, debriefed, or numbered!”

    Well, except for the SSN.

    I believe most people don’t really think about questions on polls, hence you get very different results depending on how you phrase things.

  • the problem child

    When this law is actually applied in a color blind manner (ha!), I suspect all of those undocumented white racists will change their minds about the desirability of carrying “papers”. On the other hand: Show us your birf certifikat!

  • V572625694

    Tweety had it right yesterday: middle-aged white males driving around in their delivery trucks or making sales calls are mad: mad that their 401(k)s got wiped out and that the people who did it got a big handout, that their kids are wearing eye-makeup and listening to “music” that makes your ears bleed, that every time they get a raise the cost of everything goes up a bit more, that the “equity” they thought they had in their house has gone negative, that their wives bear no resemblance to the pr0n hotties they see on

    They’ve got to blame somebody, and Rush and Beck are on the radio to give them the target: Mexicans! They’re taking our jobs! Get rid of ’em!

  • Geogre

    [re=576367]Serolf Divad[/re]: The glorious, safe 1950’s!
    Wonderful Truman, who wanted to draft the steel workers so they couldn’t strike, etc.

    A Life Magazine poll in 1959 said the #1 fear of Americans was not teh bomb or The Bomb, not Commanists or Communists: it was “juvenile delinquency.” I.e. Richie Cunningham and Fonzie were “Wild in the Streets” back in the 1950’s. This is why polls are so useful and telling us what the media landscape finds profitable to discuss, and why they are useless at telling us anything else.

  • TGY

    ..and this is why minorities need protection from the majority.

  • MysteriousHoatzin

    Most Merkins prolly think that producing a driver’s license is proof enough.

  • harry palmer

    The same people for the AZ law are the ones against big government. And they supported telecom amnesty and warrantless wiretapping and bombing Muslins and global empire. Cuz that’s what CEO Jesus means by freedumb.

  • Katydid

    [re=576367]Serolf Divad[/re]: To be serious for a moment, I’m not sure I believe that poll, or any poll, but I’ll admit that I don’t entirely understand how pollsters are so sure they’ve got a true representative sampling. Even if I did understand, or maybe I do, I don’t believe they’re all accurate, or can be.

    Second, I’d like to see figures on the number of Americans, not just white Americans, who disapproved of interracial marriage in 1958. The Wiki article is, I don’t know how to say it, caucasian-centric on this point.

    Now back to our regular programming.

  • ManchuCandidate

    Yeah, cause rich white people WOULD NEVER EVER fuck them over.

  • JMP

    [re=576375]V572625694[/re]: Let’s face it: Rush and Beck’s shows are the two-minute hate, but much, much longer.

  • Clancy_Pants

    “I personally believe that U.S. Americans are unable to do so because some people out there in our nation don’t have maps and I believe that our education like such as in South Africa and Iraq and everywhere like such as and I believe that they should our education over here in the U.S. should help the U.S. or should help South Africa and should help Iraq and the Asian countries so we will be able to build up our future for us,”

  • x111e7thst

    [re=576371]Long Form Def Certificate[/re]: No me llames frijolero, Pinche gringo puñetero

  • Berkeley Bear

    There was a weird little film called “A Day without a Mexican” a few years back. Arizona (and a lot of other cracker-ass locales) may get to see the live performance art version shortly.

  • weejee

    Zer must be order, ja?

  • Katydid

    [re=576379]harry palmer[/re]: Yeah, the inconsistency makes me crazy. Worse, if you try to point it out to even well-meaning, not wingnuts, they cannot see it. I also think, to a large degree, the people who are for this law don’t understand it or the ramifications.

    I was arguing with someone the other day who insisted the AZ law just codifies existing practice in AZ, and it’s a good thing because of all the violence from “illegals,” and he wouldn’t mind showing his papers, and his friends agree (all white people, btw). He’s not a wingnut, nor is he stupid, but he was wrong on a key point of the law, and refused to be persuaded. He saw no inconsistency in his insistence that the AZ law wouldn’t lead to racial profiling, and his agreement that the racial profiling the NJ state troopers “used” to do was entirely wrong. And when I brought up Jihad Jane, the plane into the federal building guy, etc., he just didn’t want to hear it. All racial profiling is not the same is his take. Aargh.

    OK, no more serious, I promise.

  • Zadig

    The funny thing about these sorts of polls is, the number of people who support the detainment of “undocumented” people would drop by 66%, if the question was phrased thus:

    “Do you approve of a law giving police authority to detain YOU if, on say a routine traffic stop, you are unable to produce sufficient verification that you are in the United States legally?” And a follow up, “Are you aware that a Driver’s License does not qualify as ‘sufficient documentation’?”

    So many times I’ve filled out a job application and seen something about being able to produce documentation that I have the legal right to work in the States, and I’ve thought: ‘good thing they’ll never ask a pasty kid like me for this stuff, because I don’t even know where to start.’

  • Geogre

    [re=576380]Katydid[/re]: Accurate samples in polls
    An accurate sample would be for the purposes of the poll. Thus, they get “registered voters” (in the days of the poll tax, that’s not fair, and in the days before 18 year old voters, it’s not what it would be), or “likely voters,” or they get “demographic sample.”

    That last one is the freakiest, IMO. One gets excluded from said surveys for being too informed, for example — for exceeding the “average” that has been pre-defined (by survey), for exceeding the “average” level of activism on an issue, etc. The poll is supposed to identify the inactive average. The inactive average is, on average, inactive, which is what makes polls of this nature (ones on cultural issues) self-consuming. If a group is, by definition and criteria, not “activist” or “informed,” then the group is going to be a following tail and a recipient group. In other words, those polls tell us what messages “people” are receiving from their chosen media.

    Polls like that are a thermometer stuck in the mud. They don’t tell the weather. They just show what weather hit most recently.

  • Baldar T Flagass

    [re=576385]Berkeley Bear[/re]: Actually, here in South Texas, TODAY is officially “Day Without A Mexican.

  • Jimb

    71% of Americans believe in the Devil, too, so perhaps many them believe the Mexicans are Devils.

  • Absolutely Fapulous

    I wonder what fraction of these people were against filling in their census forms…

  • harry palmer

    [re=576387]Katydid[/re]: “he wouldn’t mind showing his papers”

    Maybe we could think of ways to cut red tape, make the government more efficient in how they could enforce this law … thinking … I know – armbands. They could have tacos on em for Messicans, crescents for Muslins … just spitballin here …

  • ph7

    Fox News current mantra: anti-Arizona protests are “Hysteria”. [Hysterical = wife]

  • Katydid

    [re=576390]Geogre[/re]: Thank you for that. So my not understanding was more perceptive than I knew. Many (most?) polls are bullshit, at the very least people interpret them inaccurately, and they are therefore meaningless.

    I would like to post your response to every blog, and e-mail it to every journalist and White House correspondent in the U.S.

  • Oldskool

    It’s hard to get excited about immigrants, illegal or otherwise, if you ever took history in grade school. Anglos were the worst immigrants EVER. Our whole philosophy was smash-and-grab. We should be grateful Mesicans aren’t centuries ahead of us in firearms technology.

  • V572625694

    [re=576382]JMP[/re]: Ha ha, Orwell thought in a future totalitarian government would reduce the size of language to make disloyal thought impossible. Instead we’ve had a terrible linguistic inflation, where torture is called “enhanced interrogation techniques.” Feel free to supply further examples.

  • Prommie

    [re=576375]V572625694[/re]: They’re mad because post-reagan conservatism is nothing less than an all-out attack on the middle class. Or we could call it, capital turning against its own ally, the bourgeoisie. Trotsky is the key, he answers all questions about what is going on in the US today. The decline in the petit bourgeoisie is mirrored by an explosion of the lumpenproletariat. Sarah Palin is their queen. The anger is the misdirected animosity of the lumpen proles, who think they are bourgeoisie, and thus are blind to their own self-interest because they lack class consciousness and don’t realize that labor is the source of all intrinsic value, instead they fetishize commodities in a rampantly materialist, consumption-based society. Something like that.

  • Atlas Spanked

    No surprise in these stats. For the last 20 years, most polls have shown that roughly 60 to 70 percent of Americans support more restricted – or better enforced – immigration quotas. So we can all deride this poll, but it’s remarkably consistent with previous responses from a wide variety of sources. And maybe, just maybe, there’s a good reason why.

  • National Turkey

    [re=576378]MysteriousHoatzin[/re]: As a (WASP-y/Yankee) Merkin, I did assume that a DL was sufficient proof of legal status. What would I have to show a cop to prove my legal status? Social Security card? Birth certificate? Federal ID?

  • Katydid

    [re=576397]harry palmer[/re]: I tried a similar line of thought using his heritage…couldn’t budge him. He just wants the illegals out, period. Afterwards, another friend brought up the possibility that he’s racist. I never saw any other signs of it, ever, though, so I’m not sure where he’s coming from. Bad media messaging maybe. I just somehow doubt he’s a secret racist, but he could be a little bit. After all, everyone’s a little bit racist, according to Avenue Q.

  • harry palmer

    [re=576405]National Turkey[/re]: ”
    What would I have to show a cop to prove my legal status? Social Security card? Birth certificate? Federal ID?”

    None of these were good enough for Obomber.

  • BeWoot

    Always with the Nazis.
    Our world is metaphor-starved. We need fresh despots!

  • Baldar T Flagass

    [re=576394]Jimb[/re]: I know a few Mexicans who are Devils; not because they have an affinity for brimstone, but because they attended ASU.

  • V572625694

    [re=576403]Prommie[/re]: The real genius of whoever is doing this to us is that they hold out the carrot of getting rich (viz: Joe the Plumber) while removing any means of doing so (higher and higher tuition at the trust fund madrassas where future hedge fund managers are trained). Want to hear a nice rant about how a 401(k) is a terrible, terrible deal for the average worker? Probably not, but anyone can do the math.

    We’re well off the Path of Funny here, and it’s getting depressing.// TruckNutz! Dick jokes! Drill baby drill!

  • Prommie

    [re=576399]Katydid[/re]: Polls are very accurate, so long as the sample is random, randomness produces the very best samples, once you get to around 1,000 people, a poll is as good as a census. The problem is getting a random sample, the availability of people, their willingness to answer the phone, and to answer the questions, leads to self-selection. To counter this, pollsters try to “re-create” randomness by constructing samples with demographics which other polls undertaken for this purpose tell them a truly random sample would have.

  • harry palmer

    [re=576406]Katydid[/re]: ”
    After all, everyone’s a little bit racist, according to Avenue Q.”

    We’re tribal. Just like the chimpanzees, who have gang wars and raid other groups for thier wimmins & bananas. It’s in the DNA.

  • BeWoot

    The up-side of the Arizona law is that maybe now I’ll finally be able to get a job … as a roofer in Phoenix this summer.

  • proudgrampa

    [re=576405]National Turkey[/re]: In Utah, effective this year, you have to show proof of US citizenship or legal residence and that you have the right to work here just to apply for a driver’s license or renew.

  • Katydid

    The problem is you’re allabuncha bleeding heart liberals who wouldn’t know what’s good for Murika if it came into your house illegally, smashed you in the face, and charged you with assaulting a federal agent. TruckNutz also.

  • National Turkey

    Wow, LA Times renders Godwin’s law null before we can even read the article!

  • JMP

    [re=576388]Zadig[/re]: About the only thing that really would work to prove citizenship is a passport; which most Americans of the redneck persuasion, being incurious about the rest of the world and/or poor, don’t have, but which ironically most Mexican-Americans do have now that one’s needed to visit family back home.

    [re=576402]V572625694[/re]: We’ve also got the POWs and suspected criminals called “enemy combatants”.

  • Long Form Def Certificate

    [re=576412]harry palmer[/re]: We need to be more like Bonobos. Just cold fuckin’.

  • snideinplainsight

    67% approve of allowing police to detain anyone who cannot verify that they are in the country legally.

    The solution is for a couple smarty-ass ‘zona cops to just lock up a lot of white people. Probably never happen, but it would be awesomely sweet.

    Who’s carrying around their birth certificate, anyway? Just Obama really, cause he gets asked about it all the time. Mine’s at home in an envelope labeled ‘IMPORTANT PAPERS’.

  • Prommie

    [re=576412]harry palmer[/re]: We are social and altruistic with “us.” We are brutal and violent with “them.” We vary only in our personal definitions of “us” and “them.”

    [re=576410]V572625694[/re]: Yes, yes, thats what I am going on about, the bourgeoisie identify with capital. Come see the comical irony produced by a lack of class-consciousness in a large segment of society which has fallen from the bourgeoisie and have become lumpenproles, also known as “teabaggers.”

    Of course, what Trotsky was actually describing in these terms was a nation’s descent into fascism, so it really cannot possibly apply to the US right now, can it?

  • weejee

    Plz forgive this jump back to a previous topic, but the Alabamy evilutionist is a Jeebus lovin’ creationist.

    That thread like this thread on political horseshit makes me nostalgic for things like the Cuban Missile Crisis when the threat of global nuclear annihilation kept pols’ focus from drifting into such nonsense. Oh, wait never mind. There were folks like Bull Conner, Strom Thurmond, George Wallace, and Phyllis Schlafly. And fuck, Phyllis is still around. Where’s the stake? I know I got an oak stake around here someplace…mutter, mutter, also, too.

  • Surfeit O’Hubris

    [re=576402]V572625694[/re]: In terms of vocabulary, that’s true. But by defining President Obama and Elena Kagan as “radical left”, or at least as the farthest left it’s possible to be, our established political discourse has made sure that a whole broad swath of thought simply has no voice and no place on the intellectual landscape.

    That’s not very snarky, so I guess I need to add Needs moar trucknutz or Titz or gtfo or some such.

  • Buzz Feedback

    Beans and rice protest lunch.

  • mush

    I got two words for ya: Brown Shirts. So many parallels that’s it’s truly getting scary Mary.

  • Radiotherapy

    [re=576410]V572625694[/re]: 70% of people think Dane Cook is “funny”.

  • Geogre

    Try finishing a survey/poll if you have a Ph.D.
    “What is your highest level of education?”
    “Oh, thank you for your time.”

    It works for jury duty, too, by the way, and I understand that the Bush Administration knew of some places for getting Ph.D.’s without even attending college. The inventor of Zicam (spray heavy metals up your nose… it’s better than beans!) (advertise on Rush!) got two Ph.D.’s before he got a bachelors.

  • harry palmer

    [re=576419]Long Form Def Certificate[/re]: I think the Bonobos *say* they’re all peace, love, dope, but upon further study they’re like compassionate conservatives – fuckin [i]and[/i] fuckin each other over.

  • JoeMac

    As a long time college professor I can tell you I have come to the conclusion that many Americans are ignorant assholes by choice. Many have no interest in knowing things that can help them navigate their lives. Rather, they want the dogma their pastor has laid on them to be confirmed in class. And don’t bother us with any of those pesky facts or evidence.

  • Johnny Zhivago

    79% of Americans: Not Careful What they Wish For!!!

  • vespula maculata

    And it’s the same 59% who’ll be most vigorously waving flags this coming Memorial Day, “honoring” those who died to preserve liberty. I should have put more effort into it when I was younger to become an every-day drinker.

  • Real DC Native

    [re=576412]harry palmer[/re]: There are three kinds of people in the United States:

    1.) Racists and freely admit it and think it’s fine to be racists.
    2.) Racists who won’t admit to themselves or anyone else that they are racists.
    3.) Racists who recognize their own racism as a problem and struggle to confront it every day.

    Wanting to beat the crap out of some guy who cut you off in traffic is also in the DNA but not doing it is called civilization.

  • Gun-toting Progressive

    [re=576414]BeWoot[/re]: Uh, this would presuppose the fact that there is any building going on in Phoenix.

  • WadISay

    [re=576398]ph7[/re]: Thanks a bunch for making me look at the Fox poll, in which 91% of repondents think the anti_AZ protests have “lost touch with reality.” I voted “reasonable reaction to unjust law”, but, out of 43,000 respondents, I think I was the only one voting that way.

  • Real DC Native

    Of the 59%:

    White middle class – Yes!
    White low income: Hell Yes!
    Black or Latino: They need a new law to do that? (recorded as yes).

  • harry palmer

    [re=576440]Real DC Native[/re]: “Wanting to beat the crap out of some guy who cut you off in traffic is also in the DNA but not doing it is called civilization.”


  • Prommie

    [re=576426]mush[/re]: Actually, its happening more the way it happened in Italy than in Germany, thats why Trotsky is so instructive. I should say “It happened,” because we are already fascist, we have one openly fascist party, the GOP, and another fascist party which adorns itself with the empty symbols of the fractured special interests which progressivism has splintered into.

  • Long Form Def Certificate

    [re=576430]harry palmer[/re]: That “compassionate conservatism” ended up finding Mark Sanford his soulmate, so cannot be all bad.

  • JMP

    [re=576406]Katydid[/re]: Hell, it’s impossible not to become a little racist; even babies learn racism quickly:
    “In fact, our initial moral sense appears to be biased toward our own kind. There’s plenty of research showing that babies have within-group preferences: 3-month-olds prefer the faces of the race that is most familiar to them to those of other races; 11-month-olds prefer individuals who share their own taste in food and expect these individuals to be nicer than those with different tastes; 12-month-olds prefer to learn from someone who speaks their own language over someone who speaks a foreign language.”

  • V572625694

    [re=576448]Real DC Native[/re]: Well stated.

    [re=576442]Gun-toting Progressive[/re]: Ha ha, the sun will bleach those empty tract houses into picturesque ruins in just a few years.

  • m_supercomputer

    Sorry for the unfunny, but this doesn’t surprise me. I use my mother as a focus group for these things – white, middle class, reasonably informed but able to be misled by GOP messaging (she voted for W in ’04, despite me raving angrily about his abuses near-constantly, because Kerry was ‘too wimpy’). And she supports this. I’ve explained that it places an awful burden on natural-born and naturalized Hispanic citizens, that illegal immigration could be cut down to practically nothing if we actually got serious about punishing the companies that hire/exploit illegal immigrants, that from a law enforcement perspective it just makes their jobs harder, that there’s enormous potential for abuse. She was at least made uncomfortable by the first point, but overall her response was “well, they had to do something.” Sigh.

  • harry palmer

    [re=576459]Long Form Def Certificate[/re]: Yes, but if Mark Sanford actually read the jeebus he fetishizes so creepily he would see that divorce was the one thing he really hated the most before becoming a zombie. So it’s ok for him (Mark Sanford) to fall in love with whoever he wants to, but for thee … I guess it means the bonobos have more integrity.

  • Ken Layne

    [re=576376]Geogre[/re]: A Life Magazine poll in 1959 said the #1 fear of Americans was not teh bomb or The Bomb, not Commanists or Communists: it was “juvenile delinquency.” I.e. Richie Cunningham and Fonzie were “Wild in the Streets” back in the 1950’s. This is why polls are so useful and telling us what the media landscape finds profitable to discuss, and why they are useless at telling us anything else.

    In fairness to the scared Jim Backus dads of 1959, within a very few years a lot of those pissed off kids were marching for the New Left and SDS — good causes, but scary to mom ‘n pop! — and a few years later they were burning draft cards and saying “far out” while on the dope. But then the parents voted for Nixon as president in ’68 and ’72, and that’s how we got out of “all those problems,” as Trent Lott said.

  • Prommie

    [re=576488]Ken Layne[/re]: Don’t downplay the evil of the rock-n-roll, got the kids all listening to and fraternizing with the coloreds, and thats where the sex and drugs came from, the coloreds.

  • HuddledMass

    [re=576403]Prommie[/re]: Not “something like that.” That.

  • I Heart Accuracy

    [re=576403]Prommie[/re]: So they’re too dumb to look at a mirror, basically.

  • Pandy

    [re=576367]Serolf Divad[/re]: Correction, most Americans ARE bigots.

  • notreallyhelping

    I’m sure none of those people would object to being tatooed with a bar code, you known, so the police could just scan ’em. All for the law and orderness.

    “Um, Mr. Jones, it seems there’s a matter of unpaid parking tickets on your account.”

  • Native of SL UT

    Everybody get in line for your new government issued Biometric Identification Tracking Chip for Homeland Security (BITCHS). We will then know our proper place in the order of things.

  • mustardman

    All this proves is that stupid people breed faster.

  • JMP

    [re=576526]notreallyhelping[/re]: It’s too bad that sometimes it seems the only thing preventing mandatory RFID chipping are the insane fears of the fundies.

  • schadenfreudian slip

    omg, Long Form Def Certificate just quoted a lyric from a song that’s been in my head since this whole AZ flap started. STANDING OVATION, LONG FORM

  • BobTheBuilder

    You can’t spell “Arizona” without “Nazi.”

  • Lascauxcaveman

    [re=576405]National Turkey[/re]: What would I have to show a cop to prove my legal status? Social Security card? Birth certificate? Federal ID?

    Glad you asked! Just ask your friendly neighborhood census worker to implant a handy US Census Certfied RFID chip in your scalp, then the cops won’t even have to pull you over; they can scan you from a tailing position.

  • Jim89048

    [re=576362]smitallica[/re]: +1

  • Gumboz1953

    [re=576467]m_supercomputer[/re]: Your mother and my mother must be clones. My mother would say exactly the same thing. Which makes us related, somehow.

  • Lascauxcaveman

    [re=576467]m_supercomputer[/re]: overall her response was “well, they had to do something.

    Since your mom has probably never heard of Godwin’s Law, you could respond with “Just like Hitler had to do something about those terrible Jews, messing up Europe back in the 1930s?”

    It’s quite an apt parallel, and actually warranted in this case.

  • rottenart

    [re=576431]JoeMac[/re]: Sigh. You know, I went to grad school so’s I could teach but between sitting in on faculty meetings and dealing with all those little lunatics, I’m think I should maybe consider sticking my head in a bowl of gin as oppose to entering academia.

  • Guppy06

    100% of those in favor don’t realize that neither state-issued driver’s licenses (REAL ID or otherwise) nor Social Security cards actually prove US citizenship. 0% of those in favor have a valid US passport, nor would they voluntarily go through the process (and pay the fees) to get one.

    The only ones able to comply with this law are the one who are complaining about it.

  • rottenart

    [re=576655]rottenart[/re]: oppose*d*, ‘tard.

  • Bill the Cat

    Sanctimonious idiots – do you not recognize there is a problem and that the elected officials in Washington have been refused to address it for years. Did you know you can read the actual bill and it’s only about a page long so you likely won’t loose attention. Go visit Arizona or South Texas BOYCOTT CALIFORNIA

  • Prommie

    [re=576668]Bill the Cat[/re]: Mom?

  • natoslug

    I agree with the 67%. Let’s have the police go into all kindergartens, elementary and high schools and detain anyone not carrying a valid passport, put a stop to all these illegals early on. I’m sure that would go over well with everyone, right? Just let me know the day before so I can send my kids with their passports . . .

  • Bill the Cat

    [re=576679]Prommie[/re]: Nope – Dad

  • One Yield Regular

    Methinks I’m starting to understand what those Maine tea-baggers meant by “Austrian economics.”

  • Bill the Cat

    [re=576656]Guppy06[/re]: Did you read the bill?

  • Real DC Native

    [re=576405]National Turkey[/re]: Being ethnically ambiguous in appearance, I actually emailed the AZ attorney general and the AZ tourist bureau to ask what kind of ID I should carry if I visited AZ. I have not gotten an answer back. Since then I’ve just decided to avoid the state.

  • JMP

    [re=576668]Bill the Cat[/re]: Not being a racist, yes I will say that there is no problem.

  • Guppy06

    [re=576710]Bill the Cat[/re]: You mean this one? The one you told people to “go read” but decided not to post an actual link to, probably because 19 pages is considerably longer than the “one page” you claim it is?

    If you’re suspected of being an alien, you have to produce documents demonstrating your immigration status upon demand. If you’re an illegal alien, you probably don’t have such documents on your person… but the same thing is true of non-aliens. Hilarity ensues!

    What do they accept as proof of “legal status?” You can pull out your AZ driver’s license (even though it’s neither an EDL nor REAL ID compliant, which means both CBP and TSA agents are required to point and laugh at you), or you can try something from out-of-state that, in Arizona’s opinion, required you to sufficiently prove citizenship.

    So the upshot of this “one page” law you’re touting is that not only will it fail to protect us from the menace of illegal Canadian snowbirds (“Yours to Discover–We’re done with it!”), but I dare not show my vaguely Puerto Rican face in AZ without my passport, lest I fail to properly signal a lane change.

  • Darkness

    [re=576668]Bill the Cat[/re]: The Equal Protection clause isn’t even a whole sentence. Why don’t you start by reading that. here’s a link even. Or does literally everything in the constitution mean shit to you people aside from the part about shooting whatever the fuck you feel like?

    Screaming about loss of freedumz then rallying and screaming for Arizone to install a fucking police state is just beyond comprehension. Jesus, you people are thick.

  • GOPCrusher

    [re=576710]Bill the Cat[/re]: These people contribute to global warming by repeating this phrase over and over.

  • bittybittychangchang

    I’m in AZ and I still don’t know what “the problem” is that requires a law. Unless other states have different degrees of “illegal” that they only teach about in elementary ethnic studies classes.

    Can the brown folks still learn about Ev Mecham?

  • m_supercomputer

    [re=576589]Gumboz1953[/re]: Wonketeers with well-meaning but fearful and slightly bigoted mothers unite!

    [re=576592]Lascauxcaveman[/re]: I did something like that, and she got defensive and told me that since she wasn’t saying *I* was wrong, it was rude of me to say she was wrong. I officially gave up on the conversation at that point.

  • Bill the Cat

    [re=576770]Guppy06[/re]: You know, your right. I failed to do my own research and was suckered by an article that contained a modified version of the bill. The full bill is vastly different.

  • One Yield Regular

    There’s a nice scene in one of Luis Urrea’s great non-fiction books where he recounts some visiting German officials being given a guided tour of the U.S./Mexico border by San Diego area state police and border patrol. The hosting officials start proudly boasting about the fence being built, as the Germans stand around uncomfortably until one of them says, “We tore OUR wall DOWN.”

  • Geogre

    Re: Bill the Cat:
    I know this is a dead post now, and it stopped being funny, but “there is a problem” is really aggravating. It’s lazy thinking.

    Remember how we had a massive “problem” with “shark attacks” in 2000? Remember the sudden “problem” with baggy pants?

    Before anyone goes passing any law abridging or even potentially abridging fundamental rights, or opening a loophole for such abridgments, we need actual analysis of problems that demonstrate that they are not 1) property crime, 2) security, 3) cannot be met in any other possible way, no matter how expensive. “Exigency is the creed of tyrants,” as William Pitt said.

    In this case, the sudden “problem” appears to be isolated incidents that are unrelated except in the immigration status of those involved. (“Hey, both were bowlers, too, so we have a problem with bowling lanes!”) Aside from that, there are economic migrants exacerbating conditions for the underclass. These things are being dealt with, in the first case, and can be dealt with by positive steps in the second.

    Besides, aren’t you supposed to say, “Ack?”

  • digitalpug

    Wait, white people have no problem with “darkies” being harrassed?

    I have an idea.
    Let’s pass a law than any Hispanic person can demand to see any white person’s birth certificate
    at any time, for any reason, as many times per day as the Hispanic people want.

    We’ll soon know if “rounding up the white folk” is racial profiling.

  • letsroll

    Have you read the law (SB1070)? I dont think you have. In fact, I doubt anyone outside of Arizona has. It is the same as existing Federal Law. But you are having too much fun calling people racists and Nazis to care about that. It’s just an excuse to act ignorant and stupid. The truly scary thing about all of this is watching people in powerful positions attack with such verocity at something without having even read it. You dont know what Nazi-ism is, trust me you do not know. But if we adopted your philosophies then we would indeed come to learn about it. Arizona happens to be extremely race friendly. It has always been that way. To call a State a racist State and all it citizens racists is something that exhibits such ignorance that it is not worth commenting on. You dumbasses are having so much fun thinking that there are going to be midnight roundups that you refuse to understand that all this law does is grant to state authorities the powers that the feds have but do not use. All it does is allow a police officer to inquire into immigration status if that officer has performed a routine stop (such as a traffic stop). Whenever a cop stops you the very first thing he/she does is ask for your ID. There are 4 forms of ID that will immediately settle the immigration question. How is this actually any worse than existing traffic stops and what transpires. It seems a hell of a lot less severe than those mystery night-time check points going on right now in Mexico on the way to Rocky Point. Why dont you get more worried about that. because in all actuality, that sort of “life” is what we in Arizona have decided we do not want. Apparently you do want it. Then you will know nazi-ism. Our law enforcement has the right to ascertain if a “quest” in our country is here legally. Those “guests” are required by federal law to have on their possession their immigration status papers at all times. Why are you not protesting the federal government?? You need to get your head and your ass wired together moron cause you are not in line with how a majority of America is thinking. Spend some time in our deserts here in Arizona before you write another moronic word. The damage you are causing this nation is unforgiveable. You are a traitor and an embarrassment to all Americans, of all colors, races, and religions.

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