Wonkette
YOU SCOOPED US, WASHINGTON POST. We thought the same thing today! When Barack Obama reversed his decision to release photographic evidence of authorized-from-the-top, brutal, illegal detainee abuse that would have compelled the DoJ to prosecute people for crimes (MUST NEVER HAPPEN), we thought about how AWESOME this will be politically, just like that time Bill Clinton didn’t care for a black rapper during a campaign and a few conservative voters mused, “Okay, well, as long as he hates the blacks too…”
But you, YOU published it first, David Ignatius:
Obama seems to have concluded that to achieve the right balance on controversial Bush-era issues such as interrogation — summed up in the president’s frequent admonition that we need to look forward rather than backward — he will have to disappoint some liberal supporters.
[...]
Is this a ‘Sister Soulja’ moment on national security, like bill [sic] Clinton’s famous criticism of a controversial rap singer during the 1992 presidential campaign — which upset some liberal supporters but polished his credentials as a centrist? We’ll have to wait and see, but certainly military officers I spoke with this week were pleased — even as the ACLU was indignant.
Ha ha ha! David Ignatius wrote, “Is this a ‘Sister Soulja’ moment on national security,” ha ha, whoa, hey, whoaaaa…
(Our local newspaper is written by daywalking sociopaths!)
What the fuck?
If there is a just God, the Washington Post will go out of business very soon.
they (WAPO) are WORTHLESS these days.
A case of “ridiculous comparison”, even for the Post.
Funny how every crime so far has been in the past and that doesn’t completely grind the courts to a stop. Hell, if you are young and not white and five-finger a mickey, you’ll serve more time than any white-on-white-collar embezzler. Oops, was that too librul?
“Barack Obama reversed his decision to release photographic evidence of authorized-from-the-top, brutal, illegal detainee abuse that would have compelled the DoJ to prosecute people for crimes”
Back up. Are you you trying to say that unless the public is given access to these photographs, no one will be prosecuted for the alleged crimes? WTF??? How the fuck does MY not seeing the photos preclude someone with prosecutorial authority from seeing them and pursuing the matter vigorously? Someone clear this up for me please.
Oh, and if it’s all the same to Sista Soulja - ALL humans are fucking idiots. Whites don’t have the corner on that market - just the corner suite. So why are you ‘African,’ but I’m ‘white’? I’m fuckin IRISH bitch. But my heritage ain’t Ireland, nor is it America. It’s a pale blue dot.
Barack Obama does not care about Black People.
No, wait…that was the other guy.
So, I have an idea about this David Ignatius person. The idea is this: once, he was an interesting political reporter, because he was filled with bile. Then he decided, “wait, there are no heroes in my life.” Bam. Moves to sports, loses his edge. Now, tryna get it back. Then I’m thinking, Oh, shit, That’s David Maraniss. Ignatius is the Armenian who picked a fight with the Turkish Prime Minister (at Davos!) and lived to tell.
True story. I’m an idiot. Also.
If you’re going to make an inane metaphor, you should at least spell her name right. Souljah. Even this white boy knew that.
Also, with all due respect for the enormity of the Souljah thing, the rest of his article is pretty damn peurile as well. I look at it as a “Don’t shit where you eat” moment rather than a Sister Souljah one. He has to live with those people — all Dubya people or career military with lots invested in Iraq — and they’re going to come to light because of the ACLU lawsuit anyway, so why act like you’re abetting it if it’s just going to piss people off?
Oh, I know why — because that sounds reasonable and won’t make you look like an oracle if you can somehow substantiate this centrism trend in another article a month or two down the road. Smart. Keep your foot in the door, Ignatius. That’s how we get on Maher and score book deals.
Custerwolf: NO, I’m not saying that, I’m saying that it would have added MORE very very compelling, incontrovertible (and this time visual!) reasons for that, and since he’s already chosen the “no prosecutions” route, he’s sure as hell not going to let anyone see these! If they were going to rightfully prosecute, I wouldn’t care if he showed me the dumb pictures or not.
Custerwolf: I added a few more words that make it more confusing, probably.
Jim Newell: Thank you for that explanation, Jim. Another question: Obama has seen this photos - yes? If he has and he is saying “no prosecutions,” - then he will pay the price when these photos do come out (and they will eventually). So the bottom line is folks are pressing for the photos to be shown to the public so that the public will then put pressure on the administration to reverse the decision not to prosecute? If that’s the case, then I say yes - press for FULL disclosure to put pressure on them to prosecute, before any photos have to come out. The whole goddamned thing smells like bullshit to me. I’d like to trust Obama’s judgment, but that doesn’t mean I will.
I guess I’m too old to remember what a “Sister Soljah” moment is. But I am not so dumb as to second guess Barack Obama.
Jim Newell: Don’t worry - so did I.
I thought that Obama denouncing Rev. Wright was his Sister Souljah moment. Or, when he told off Bernie Mac. Or, when he preached black responsibility and Jesse Jackson threatened to cut his nuts out.
Jim, You have to wake up pretty early to out-scoop WaPo.
Hell, I bet they scooped you on the ShamWow guy getting arrested for beating up a hooker.
On the other hand, hard, unbiased news is not exactly their forte.
Jim Newell: You forgot ‘also’
Mr Newell has makes Harpers laugh!
http://www.harpers.org/archive/2009/05/hbc-90004963
Burn that fucking building down. And use printouts of the online version as kindling.
How terrible, Barack Obama ALREADY had his Sister Souljah moment FOUR MONTHS AGO ALAN!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I4MMfCffcLg
SayItWithWookies: Second paragraph just littered with pronouns without referents. It should read something like,
He has to live with those people (”Bob Gates, the secretary of defense; Adm. Mike Mullen, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff; Gen. David Petraeus, the CENTCOM commander; Gen. Ray Odierno, the U.S. commender in Iraq; and Gen. David McKiernan, the outgoing U.S. commander in Afghanstian.”) — all Dubya people or career military with lots invested in Iraq — and the photographs are going to come to light because of the ACLU lawsuit anyway, so why act like you’re abetting it if it’s just going to piss people off?
Jim Newell: I’d like to think President Obama would like favor prosecution, but I won’t go that far. I do, however, think he’s holding back and letting other forces (DOJ and popular sentiment this time) take the reins. He looks less polarizing if he doesn’t appear to be driving, and at this point he doesn’t think he has to anyway.
If he really thought torture worked and wanted the program continued, he could. The dumbest president in American history managed to torture people for eight years and nobody stopped him, so Obama could do it easily. I’m bummed that he’s not turning this into an urgent cause, but at least it’s still going on.
Just as long as the people at The Hague get to see them.
President Obama may be right that the pictures could be useful for extremist propaganda. That’s why we shouldn’t EVER abide with this sort of un-American behavior. It’s a slippery slide and just another installment of the big heap o’ steamin’ crap that we handed him in January.
Ultimately we need to do a lot of housecleaning. But with everything that he’s got on his plate I’m prepared to allow Obama some discretion.
To be fair Sista Souljah was a sucker MC.
I would like to wish a nice case of TB on David Ignatius. Can you get bit by a rat at one Sally Quinn’s cocktail parties?
Ignatius is CIA. Just sayin’.
Some of the wingnut sites are claiming Obama has seen the photos and they aren’t that bad so they aren’t torture so he doesn’t want to be shown up.
Also, why were the Abu Ghraib photos released? They certainly made a lot of people all over the world incensed, including me.
SayItWithWookies: Well there’s still time to see what happens. And Afghanistan is going to be extremely difficult, and he needs to do what he can there. But my point with Ignatius was the way he so easily (but predictably) looked at something this serious, a legal matter — legal vs. illegal — as a petty right v. left campaign issue. Who thinks in such a detached way? Why do they have newspaper columns and teevee shows?
Custerwolf:
1. Barry saw them and said “Oh shit”
2. Barry saw them and said “Nothing new to see, same ol’, same ol…why give them clip-art for anti-America posters”
3. Barry never saw them and is promoting the “look forward” meme, revealing a new side.
In my opinion, what is NOT shown is worse than whatever they could show…we all have some pretty nasty imaginations. Haven’t we had 8 years too much of redaction?
Wasn’t there some discussion of the fact that if these photos were made public, even more Afghans and Iraqis etc would hate us and kill our soldiers? So while there are many moral and legal reasons for not torturing and abusing prisoners and detainees there is a practical reason too. It makes people HATE us and want to KILL us.
Fuck. This makes me so angry I’m shaking and typing in caps.
and I’m out of Ambien
good luck going to sleep now
Jim Newell: To line the nation’s birdcages and babysit the olden ones.
MGBYG: chascates: Barry was lying. This is what we’re talking about:
http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1001218842
And the tapes were destroyed illegally, remember.
Perhaps Barry’s doing the rope-a-dope: he got a lot of heat for releasing these on Memorial Day, so he says he doesn’t want them released. But the ACLU is not going to rest with that & Barry will eventually end up having to release the pics. BUT, he can say he didn’t want to/fought against the release/etc. & he ends up right back where he started to releasing the pics. And he comes off looking like King Solomon. Yes, no, too much to drink??
the schmada: Ha! He has Broder on the list as well. Good man.
Jim Newell: Ah, yes. Now I recall all of that. And this too is the result of a court order. Is this court considered a right- or left-leaning one?
SayItWithWookies: One could make a reasonable argument why those photos should not be released and one could argue that there are compelling reasons not to move forward on prosecuting people but one would have a lot more credibility if they would have done or said anything in protest against torture. To not have done so would makes you just another Media Hack whose doomed existence is growing closer to an end and whose demise will bring nary a tear.
If the Supreme Court rules against Obama, then the load is off him, and he can say, “I haz to do it because of our fine system of separation of powers blah blah.”
If the Court rules for Obama, the rednecks will say that maybe that nigra ain’t so bad after all, for a nigra.
If he showed ‘em, people would lose interest and turn the channel back to American Idol or whatever. Not showin’ ‘em, he gets us all riled and verbal and hoping for attention from The Hague.
In the interests of appeasing the ACLU, Obama HAS ordered the release of all nude photos of Miss California USA, however.
Huh. I have no memory of anything that any of you are talking about, and I haven’t started drinking yet. Mind you, I got fired today, so I’m a little dazed. But what? Bill Clinton doesn’t like black wimminz? I honestly didn’t know that.
AnnieGetYourFun: FIRED! What’s up with that? In which case you should already be drinking.
AnnieGetYourFun: WTF????? If you need food, I can bring it to you.
chascates: Yeah. Something about buttsecks in the break room?
AnnieGetYourFun: I’m so sorry to hear that. It sucks. I am amazed that you haven’t started drinking yet. I usually do that before I log into Wonkette.
…Of course that means that you will be able to post more.
But good luck lining-up your next gig. What kind of work do you do?
AnnieGetYourFun: What kind of a hell hole did you work in that would restrict buttsecks in the break room? Lousy bastards.
CockedAle: You have a point there.
AnnieGetYourFun: It’s all fun and games until someone knocks the bagels off the table.
AnnieGetYourFun: wankers.
Shoot, I was kinda hoping to get in a big fight with Jim
so we’d have to have make-up sex.
Jim Newell: God damn. I can see not releasing some of the photos and videos and recordings — or at least washing your hands of the matter. Not prosecuting, though — if half of that’s true, then not prosecuting is incomprehensible. It’s to condone institutionalized sadism that now riddles the armed forces. Not that I needed convincing before this, but — recordings of mothers being forced to listen to their children being sodomized? What the fuck has this country turned into?
Oh, and a little icing on this cake — you know what Assity calls it when reasonable people call for prosecution of torturers and their enablers and apologists? Criminalizing politics.
SayItWithWookies: Well, since he also calls “a scripted juvenile flirtation with a tranny” a “Coulter interview,” I guess it’s no surprise.
Here’s some OT shit because torture and Annie getting fired are complete downers.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ie7zGJsBGg
Custerwolf: Jesus - my girlfriend just e-mailed that to me but Youtube killed the sound. Assholz
I’m also known for bringing really bad weed to parties.
Did Obama also order brutal, illegal Sascha Baron Cohen off the internets? Cuz all the trailers on YouTubes are gone. ACLU, be thou indignant.
Hey! Just read that Washington state ex-pat and new Obama drug czar (WTFTI?)Gil Kerlewkowski has called for an end to the war on drugs - woo-hoo!!!
Smoke it if you got it.
WAPO seems to still be suffering from Bush paranoia.
Custerwolf: And a former President of Mexico called for legalizing marijuana. Do you get BC Bud there?
chascates: I get whatever Joe hands me.
we thought about how AWESOME this will be politically, just like that time Bill Clinton didn’t care for a black rapper during a campaign and a few conservative voters mused, “Okay, well, as long as he hates the blacks too…”
So what Ignatius is saying is that Obama did this because a few conservative voters will muse “Okay, well as long as he hates the Constitution too…”
I would be happy with a Truth Commission, but if not that, then I say all those who authorized torture should be prosecuted.
AnnieGetYourFun: Sorry Annie. And it sucks out there right now. But, thank God for the Democrats, there is unemployment and Washington is pretty generous. If random sex with a fellow Washingtonian will help, let me know.
Lionel Hutz Esq.: philanthropy in action.
Lionel Hutz Esq.: Custerwolf: AnnieGetYourFun: And Annie? If you need any weed, just go see Custerwolf and Joe. Gold Bar is just a short drive up the 405 & the 5, Take right on 2. Or Brothell Way. Whichever.
Lascauxcaveman: Or you could just take the river.
Lascauxcaveman: Anyone rolls me for my weed and I’m coming after you.
Custerwolf: Why is it that the people that are holding always get so violent?
So we’ve impeached three Presidents–Clinton, Nixon (he resigned just to avoid it–it counts) and Andrew Johnson–over a blow job, a burglary and civil war reconstruction policy(?), respectively.
But the planned, systematic dehumanization of hundreds, if not thousands, of innocent people in the service of a fear-mongering, war-mongering, racist, thoroughly corrupt ideology is cool.
And we’re not even going to have, like, a special prosecutor maybe just look into it to see if the corruption of everything this country is supposed to stand for might have broken a law or two?
No? Just checking.
Crab1: Word.
Custerwolf: You could just do like I did and get a prescription for weed–the dispensaries.
All I had to do was show a doctor a positive AIDS test, complain about nausea, and voila, dozens of establishments around Southern California are ready to sell me whatever I need.
And really, the only hard part of the whole experience was raping all those transvestite hookers so I could get a positive AIDS test.
assistant/atlas: But the planned, systematic dehumanization of hundreds, if not thousands, of innocent people in the service of a fear-mongering, war-mongering, racist, thoroughly corrupt ideology is cool.
Rather a harsh assessment of NASCAR, don’t you think?
assistant/atlas: Yeah, but it was worth it, right?
Hey - how’d you like my new avatar? She’s smmmmokin’
SayItWithWookies: TURN LEFT! TURN LEFT! JEFF GORDON’S A FAGGOT!
There is a second class of Gingers, the day walkers, who do have red hair but not pale skin and freckles. These day walkers are sociopaths and work at the Washington Post.
Custerwolf: When is raping transvestite hookers not worth it? I’m looking at you, Bill O’Reilly.
Lionel Hutz Esq.: Soooo…what do you think of my new bud - she’s cute ain’t she? Light her on up if’d you’d like.
Lionel Hutz Esq.: Shut up or I’ll cut you.
More likely a Mandela moment, but I’m not convinced it’s appropriate here.
Annie, sorry about the job. Been there, it sucks.
I hope some of ya’ll are right and this is another one of those Obama moments where he plays everybody and gets the pictures out via the ACLU while still looking patriotic or whatever the hell it is that the ‘center’ wants.
So as I superficially glean it, this is about WaPo’s style, not substance? A newspaper’s must die stand.
I applaud David Ignatius’s great insight that we’ll have to wait and see.
AnnieGetYourFun: will Obama release photos of this too?
This is important:
http://entertainment.timesonline.co.uk/tol/arts_and_entertainment/tv_and_radio/article6279490.ece
One thing people forget, is that the act of releasing the pictures is in and of itself a form of exploitation of the prisoners which is also illegal. The moral is : Trust in Obama, he knows what he is doing. It’s best to let Cheney swing in the wind for a little while more, everytime he does an interview he makes more admissions. Why stop him now?
OzoneTom:
Ultimately we need to do a lot of housecleaning. But with everything that he’s got on his plate I’m prepared to allow Obama some discretion.
Agreed. I’d like him to stay focused on the damage control. This ship needs a lot of repairs and upgrades. Let’s worry about punishments after we get underway.
The Washington Post is about as useful as a Radio Shack in an Amish village.
Ignatius! Krauthammer! Hiatt! Cohen!
DAMNED LIBERAL MEDIA
Custerwolf: Actually, in the strange history of American racial constructions, the Irish were black for a while. So congratulations, the fact that you can now call yourself white is progress (kinda).
SayItWithWookies: Probably the best reason for Barry’s stance on the issue is that it really doesn’t require his input, once he’s ended the authorization of torture. This thing can get on its merry way through the courts, the DoJ, and maybe an occasional ACLU lawsuit. He says “I don’t want to prosecute” or whatever, but the DoJ does not want or need his approval to do so. Aside from maybe a secret memo to Eric Holder saying “But seriously, prosecute the shit out of them” there’s not much he can DO about it.
So in his position, why not stand away from this particular fray, especially when he has twelve jillion other frays to deal with? In all likelihood, there WILL be at least some legal action here, and Barry doesn’t have to get a rep as a witchhunter. The only people who will get pissy are the folks who will probably vote for him in 2012 anyway.
I believe strongly that the fucks who did this should be locked up forever. But if I was sitting in the Oval Office right now, I can see why I might do exactly what Obama’s doing.
That’s a particularly Noonish article Ignatius wrote. All made up with no place to go.
Hey, here’s an idea. Release the photos, tell the world it’s awful how this very terrible thing happened, but it will never happen again because we are PROSECUTING THE BASTARDS.
I am not sure how the ire of Muslims is being contained by explaining that there are lots of photos that can’t be released because their terribleness is so incredible that they will infuriate the Muslims.
Oh, and can someone please explain to me how it is, exactly, that the torture that makes us so very safe has to be hidden lest people try to kill us?
doxastic: I see people in different shades of awareness, not color.
SayItWithWookies: I think it was the use of the cream cheese that really put them over the edge. What? It’s kosher. I think.