Wonkette
- ‘INSECTS PLACED IN A CONFINEMENT BOX’: We made a light joke earlier about Glenn Greenwald goin’ nuts with the highlighter on those four Bush Administration torture memos released today — almost completely unredacted — and man, he did just that. You are required to read some of the shit in these memos. This is our CIA’s War on Terror? Throwing a dumb caterpillar in a dark box but telling the detainees it’s a killer scorpion that will poison their butts? This isn’t SUMMER CAMP. [Glenn Greenwald]
I just read the memo.
We pay people to think of these things?
I see the problem. These stupid fucks confused their tortuous frat hazings for “fun”. So we were just initiating Al Zubaydah, not torturing him. You all are so uptight.
bring out the comfy chair
The worst part was making the detainees watch this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xp9Gm-aRe5A
Clearly the work of a 1st year law student at Wingnutz Online Skool of teh Lawz.
I wonder where they got the idea of making them wear a diaper, hmmmmmm
What’s even worse is Stephen (Steven) Bradbury wrote in another memo that he recognized that the State Department condemned many of the techniques he was approving but they only did that for diplomatic reasons. Unbelievable!
ihasasad: And just like vitter, after we made them shit with fear and pain, we cleaned them up……cuz we’re the good guys.
Sometimes I’ll cut a hole in a box, than put my dick in the box, than have lady shorts open the box.
Why can’t the CIA get it right?
Throw in one Teabagger, of the home-schooled variety, and I would tell all.
shortsshortsshorts: Instead of a caterpillar?
I’ve heard that the initiation for Yale’s Skull & Bones is to masturbate into the box containing Geronimo’s bones. Watching Bush do that would be far worse for a terrorist.
no snark here. those sadistic fucks.
of all the Bush dirty deeds, and there is a long deranged list, this one tops the list.
I hope Karma is real.
i haz a sad.
chascates: You know, given the choice of seeing either Dubya or John Kerry do this, I’d opt instead to slam my head repeatedly against the nearest hard surface in the hopes that sweet oblivious would take me.
They must have been channeling “Star Trek II, the Wrath of Khan,” where Ricardo Montalban puts that bug in Chekov’s ear. Great thinking, US Government! As a taxpayer, I’m proud to serve!
I think hovering over them while dangling a loogie, and then sucking it back up at the last second, would work just fine to start. My brother should apply for a job with the CIA.
What’s the big deal? Paul Atreides could hack it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g36lYOdlZ-k
(too bad this is a clip from the crappy TV version of Dune)
If you put me in a box with a caterpillar, and told me straight up it’s just a caterpillar, I would rat out fucking Anne Frank.
There’s been a misunderstanding. “Insects placed in a confinement box” is simply the Webster’s definition of “Republican government lawyers at work.”
chascates: Watching Bush do that isn’t torture. It’s terrorism.
…they will greet us as liberators…or we will hang them by their balls and beat them with socks filled with shards of broken glass!
…is this what we replaced the constitution with?
Here’s Jay Bybee, now a federal appellate court judge:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jay_Bybee
While we’re at it, let’s give him a Freedom Medal.
Fuck.
It’s moments like this that make me so very proud of my country (sob). USA! USA! USA!
*sniff*
Oops, I was channeling Glenn Beck there for a moment.
Sometimes, it’s tough to be snarky.
I want to see these fuckers on trial at the Hague.
~
Wow. I feel angry and frustrated about all of this.
I think I’ll throw a tea-party. Except, instead of tea, there will be Scotch. And instead of a bunch of losers in animal costumes, it will be me and a bottle of Scotch.
I support our troops - by that I mean that when a commanding officer orders a soldier to do stuff like this - I support that soldier’s right to shoot his commanding officer between the eyes.
it’s fascinating that someone would write all of this down..
they’ll make great exhibits at the Museum of American War Crimes..
i hope there’s an exhibit of the nooses used to hang those ‘only doing their jobs’ as well..
Country Club Jihadi: Well, at least teabagging has finally been outlawed as inhuman treatment. That was what all those patriots were celebrating yesterday, right?
comradepaulson: Once you’ve seen what passes for Bush’s manhood, you might as well gouge out your own eyes. There is no beauty anywhere in the world strong enough to blot out that sight.
prizepig: skol..
ifthethunderdontgetya: Me too! I just wish the Spanish hadn’t wussed out on war-crimes trials for the Bush Crime Family…
History will someday show that our government, the Bush years, can easily be compared to Hitler.
To the Hague with them all, cleansing we can believe in.
My point of view -
If this is the worst there is, then I’ll breath a sigh of relief. The problem is, I don’t see this as the worst. There’s evidence that detainees died during questioning. Nothing listed here will kill you. I’m sure there were methods much worse used by the US or it’s allies. I’ll be there’s a bit of “you can’t handle the truth” in what was released to the public.
I’ll hope there’s more digging.
Delicious: I don’t know—I think the worst part was making detainees watch this video:
http://vodpod.com/watch/1474570-chaka-khan-i-feel-for-you
Actually, that was the best part.
Nudity? Stress positions? Dieting? Scary catapillars? Waterboarding?
This sounds more like “Co-Ed Gone Wild Volume III”…
“walling” sounds like fun. did i say “fun”? sorry, i meant “unnecessary brutality”. i, like the us judiciary, have a tendency to confuse the two.
prizepig: can i come too?
loudensspam:The Red Cross knows for sure of 33 people killed by torture.
Some think the figure is over 100.
Since they also think about 90% of the people in these prisons were innocent of terrorism,
can some math guy figure out how many innocent people we tortured to death?
Johnny Zhivago: Rush is that you? hey man, give me a ceegar.
I see nothing in these memos about “tickle torture,” which means I am still not a war criminal and my little brother can suck on it.
rocktonsammy: Aw, c’mon Sammy. The Hague? With all that flowery language and legal technicalities? Especially with Cheney and Rove, wouldn’t it make you happier to just hear Katie Couric tell you one day that they had been taken out and shot?
Atheist Nun: too bad this is a clip from the crappy TV version of Dune
Hey! Is this the Sci-Fi Channel Dune? Seriously? I thought both mini-series they did of Dune were excellent. I love good sci-fi, though I am not a Dune book geek nor a Trekkie. Way better than that disaster of a feature film. The serieseses even got me to read the first couple of Dune books.
Oh, and torture is bad. i’m with CMike. Give ‘em the Stalin treatment. But make ‘em shit in their pants a few times before ending it.
hobospacejunkie: I liked the movie, you geek!
CaliforniaMike: Not to mention international law is about as enforceable as a shit-sandwich, BUT WHAT DO I KNOW.
CaliforniaMike:
Nope.
Cathangover: I would too. No question.
Fox actually talked about this and Krauthammer begrudgingly said water boarding just might be torture but that was about it. And if so, what’s a little torture here and there? Kristol was also there to speak but I had already thrown every possible thing in the apartment at the tv before he came on to speak so I switched to Scrubs reruns. Good ole Scrubs.
hobospacejunkie: What is inside the box? Pain.
Well gang, I come here for snark. But I just can’t get my mojo workin’ there tonight.
Long ago I got assigned (in a job, no less) to read through the transcripts of the Nuremberg trials of the Nazi doctors. I pretty much managed to forget those words and images until this afternoon, when I read those fucking memos.
Jefferson said it. “I fear for my country when I reflect that God is just.”
Canuck13652:
That would be Regent University School of Law, right?
So basically, Fear Factor without Joe Rogan.
You know what will really fuck up a prisoner? Build them a ‘box’ that is ALMOST tall enough for them to stand up in it and ALMOST wide or long enough for them to lie down in it. Then weld a metal chair full of sharp angles right in the middle of it. No windows.
Three days maximum before they start bawling.
Oh boo-hoo! These methods do work; just look at how they fucked up Glen Beck.
AxmxZ: experience?
proud to be an american i love the usa. my country has been on the wrong side of too many issues to enumerate, but if you’d told me in 2000 that it would come to this i’d have thought you a raving ninny. sweet jesus.
DC Hates Me: Nobody’s THAT cruel.
Delicious: Oh, he’s on the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals — the one all the conservatives blame for imposing liberalism on America. I guarantee you there are Ninth Circuit judges meeting right now to find out what it takes to get rid of him.
I had my doubts about whether this moment was going to happen at all, much less so soon. Given that, and how responsible they were for it, I think these pinkos are getting a membership. About time I had my hippie card.
Canuck13652: Homeskool of teh Lawz
This is a very disturbing development… which was pretty forseeable.
spymoose: But see what happens — now the dude says whatever crazy-ass shit pops into his head. In any nation the least bit capable of critical thinking he would’ve completely destroyed his credibility by now.
What pisses me off so much is that before Obama took office, I was cynically telling people that he would not have the balls to prosecute Bush Admin officials no matter what evidence he found, and that Obama would say “I want to move forwards, not backwards” (or some form of that phrase… move America forward not backward, want my administration to focus on going forward, not backward). And this is EXACTLY what Obama has said.
I’ve practiced criminal defense for many years, and not once have I ever managed to get criminal charges dropped or dismissed by invoking the “we should just look forwards, not backwards” defense/excuse. Although, to be fair, I’ve never tried because it’s so friggin frivolous and nonsensical. If someone kidnapped and tortured Obama’s daughters, would he not have the DOJ bring criminal charges because we should just look forward, and not backwards? Looking at what a criminal has done is looking backwards, and gosh darnit, that’s just so negative. Seriously?
I praise Obama for releasing these memos, especially in the face of threats from the CIA and NSA that the intelligence community would do all they can to screw him for it. But if honoring the rule of law is something Obama wants to take seriously, then it has to be enforced. That means prosecuting people who broke the law - even the last president. This “not looking backwards” bullshit is so pathetic, so predictable. It saddens me greatly that I was able to predict it word for word.
spymoose: WALNUTS! too.
The big issue is that if Obama hadn’t guaranteed no prosecutions, the war criminals inside the federal government would have assured that this info had never reached the light of day. That’s the logic behind South Africa’s Truth and Reconciliation Process - promise the apartheid-state bastards amnesty if and only if they tell the whole truth and nothing but the truth about who they had killed and tortured and how. YMMV on how well that worked.
See, nothing to worry about were not Nazi’s were much closer to Argentina or Cuba
But, seriously, Bybee needs to be impeached- I mean if I was defending say a cop of brutality charges and I appealed to the 9th couldn’t I basically argue that Bybee said it was all good?
fuck.
Well, there’s at least a part of me that’s proud to be an American today.
(That would be the part that used to enjoy pulling the wings off flies, pinning the abdomens of carpenter ants down to the deck while I fried their heads with a magnifying glass, etc. That part of me has atrophied quite a bit since, oh, my 10th birthday, but it’s still there, I guess.)
No Snark. These sadistic sons of bitches need to be prosecuted. Being human is more important than being American.
So far, Barry is letting us down, big time.
In a serious note, none of this is shocking. (It’s shocking to the conscious. I mean none of it is shocking in that we knew they were torturing.) And it is not surprising that Barry came out with the “look forward not back” routine. I don’t want this to sound like a conspiracy, it’s not, but you all know what the fuckard establishment would do if Barry went all out and called for prosecutions. They’d whine like a pack of hyenas getting their balls ripped off by a paper shredder.
Now if Bush had gotten a blow job from an intern and then lied about in a deposition, then, and only then, would there be some sort of punishment. That’s the only situation in which we actually punish our presidents. It’s in the Constitution, people, look it up!
DC Hates Me: Michael Reagan is working in his stead.
Members of the military and intelligence services using “pressure” to extract information from dangerous prisoners who may kill, maim or injure their fellows, or American citizens.
Hmmm.
Hell, call a spade a spade: A corporal tortures a prisoner to extract information. The prisoner might be completely innocent, or might be completely guilty. But the threat exists — as demonstrated by the IEUs that are exploding in the marketplaces.
Hmmm.
Yes, yes, you Wonketteers are absolutely correct. There is no moral justification, and no moral ambiduity, that could possible excuse these Truly Evil members of our military and intelligence services.
In fact, they are indistinguishable from those who flew the planes into the WTC, and who convince teenage boys to strap on explosive vests in the name of Al’lah.
No, no, actually, these American criminals are worse, because We Are A Civilized People Who Know Better.
(Man, this Moral High Horse stuff is GREAT! It’s like doing a massive hit of blotter LSD — you’re completely divorced from reality!)
Hey, did you know that there could be an entire UNIVERSE in my finger??
Neilist: Lets call a spade a spade then.
No access to charges. No access to a judge. No legal representation. The military was BUYING men on the battlefield for 3 to 5 thousand bucks.
The Red Cross states 90% of these people are/were innocent of any wrong doing.
(Which is borne out by the numbers of released, without charges, of hundreds of these dangerous prisoners.)
Israel doesn not torture. As many other war crimes they commit, why do you think Israel does not torture people? Decause it fucking does not work, and it cost money -millions of dollars-following bad leads from bad information.
We WERE a somewhat civilized nation before Bush. At least then we just tortured a few-and very probably guilty men.
Now we set up a system from the top down, specifically to torture anyone caught in this system, even if they were bought and placed in the system by the military without any evidence whatsoever…
Only a sadist or a psycho could defend that, you gun fuck.
Wait, I’m pretty sure that “INSECTS PLACED IN A CONFINEMENT BOX” is Republican for what Mark Foley wanted to do with the interns. . . .
These are not Torture Memos, these are Craig List posts from Bush appointees.
Well, the good news is that we just had people protesting the government’s ill use of power. I assume that all of them, and their Fox News sycophants like Sean Hannity and Bill O’Reilly will be spending most of the next week demanding the prosecution of Bybee and the others who allowed this to happen.
Socraticsilence: Agreed, Bybee must go. No one who’s legal reasoning is that twisted can be allowed on the bench.
Fuck the operatives, go after those who tried to justify it.
Neilist: Oh stuff it.
The policy of not torturing people is a good one for several reasons:
1. You just don’t get good information. Going all thumbscrews on someone guarantees you’ll get them to say something, even if it’s total bullshit.
2. There are better, more effective forms of interrogation. This is something that military interrogators used to get drilled in to them in the old days. You don’t HAVE to torture if you know what you’re doing.
3. If you start treating the Geneva conventions like a joke, there is no reason for your own people to be treated any differently if they fall into enemy hands.
4. It fucks up the men and women who perform the torture too. You know, the American service people you SEEM to have some regard for.
5. It fucks with morale. Believe it or not, a lot of military folks are invested in the idea that America are the good guys. Some of the people I’m talking about here are in my family, so I know whereof I speak. I have heard a gamut of rationalization, from “it’s just a few bad apples”, to “it isn’t really torture” but none of them have ever said “yeah, we torture and that’s just great ‘cuz those guys are worse”.
So whatever, dismiss it as a bunch of naive libs climbing on their high horse, but you really ought to know better.
sati demise: seconded. torture doesn’t work. well, outside of the fantasies of sadistic fucks it doesn’t, anyway. if you torture anyone enough they’ll say anything to get it to stop. and even the guilty rarely have any information beyond their own mission for that particular day. so you (whoops!) accidentally murder or at least fuck up for life a bunch of innocent people, do the same thing to a handful of people who may have been guilty of something, in order to get worthless information, 90% of which was made up to get you to stop torturing the person involved.
but yeah, if it makes you feel like jack bauer inside your own head, i guess that makes up for it.
slinkimalinki: Wait…you mean that Jack Bauer isn’t real? And real military interrogations aren’t like the ones on 24?
My.Mind.Is.Blown.
Jack Bauer wasn’t pussy enough to wait for legal memos. Legal memos take time, have revisions, signatures and the force of law. Kinda. No ticking time bomb waits for a team of lawyers.
Neilist: Your arguments are absurd. Are you suffering from sleep deprivation? That has long-term consequences, you know, and is classified as torture among civilized nations. It can even lead to insanity and death.
Your first argument seems to be that torturing innocent people is justified because a threat (IEDs) exists. Why, this pretty much justifies anything, doesn’t it? If anyone looks at you funny, you’re justified in hacking apart a puppy? Yes, you’re messing with us.
Then we are saying the military is evil. Because we are Hippies. (Flick of a lighter, sound of bubbles) I object, your honor — Captain Bummer here is not addressing the original question, and it’s killin’ my buzz.
Then the military is a bunch of terrorists just like al-Qaida. Well, no. We are a sophisticated people, and there are degrees of evil. To conflate every criticism of my country as some sort of terrorist attack upon it is patently absurd. Also I don’t give a rat’s ass about prosecuting or judging the poor bastards who were ordered to commit the acts. The people who authorized them though — now those fuckers are evil. Not Mohammad Atta evil, mind you, but call-the-cops evil at least.
That’s three strikes, Mr. gun nut. Are you gonna be shooting blanks all night?
comradepaulson: They are already whining like a pack of hyenas with their testicles caught in a paper shredder. I am merely suggesting that we turn that paper shredder up to 11.
In all seriousness, Glen makes a really good point. By releasing the memos, Barack’s giving some leverage to the people who want to see these things prosecuted (i.e., good patriotic Americans and same humans everywhere and probably also some dolphins.) It’s now up to those people (i.e. you, me) to put the pressure on and keep it on until he has no choice in the matter. I’d like to think that’s really the plan here - politically, the administration needs to be seen as obeying the will of the people, not leading the charge.
I’m still hoping other signatories to no torture treaty will do our dirty work for us. Spain is off to a decent start, though today’s development doesn’t help. In the meantime, for what it’s worth (nothing) I’ll be sending daily notes to the White House reminding them that Nazis said they were following orders, too. And I’ll ask if the “look forward, not backward” defense is a good one to use in a murder trial, say, or kidnapping. We need to be consistent with these things, so I’m hoping all good trial lawyers out there will now use this as precedent when asking for a summary judgement.
DC Hates Me: Beat me to it, you SOB. Hey, where is Joe Rogan now anyway?
Mistakes were made.
I’m so glad we’re done with this whole messy terrorism business. We caught Khalid Sheikh Mohammed and he confessed to everything and that’s that. No more terrorism has occurred since then. It was all him. One pissed off Arab dude turned us into the Monsters on Maple Street (Twilight Zone episode).
Rest in peace, Joe Rogan.
sati demise: “Israel does not torture”???
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH.
Oh, man, that was FUNNY. Can you spare some of that blotter you’re on?
[On the other hand, if you were serious, let's not waste time debating. Anyway, the truth would be too painful for you.)
SayItWithWookies: “We are sophisticated people, and there are degrees of evil.”
As you just admitted that you believe in moral relativism, rather than absolutes, there is no point in arguing with you either. You’re on the Slippery Slope already: It’s just a question of where you personally decide to slide off the course.
Also, I disagree with the Inherent Racism in your “we are sophisticated people” comment. Or at least, speak for yourself. I’m not sophisticated enough to sit in front of a computer here in the States, safe and sound, and level self-righteous broadsides at people who put their lives on the line to protect me.
That is not to say that I agree with everything that was done by the Bush Administration, whether in regards to interrogations, torture or whatever. I don’t. But I would be happy to defend, in court and before an American jury, any member of the military or intelligence service who engaged in such acts, and/or any “senior administration official” who authorized them.
The case would be a slam dunk for the defense. We’d open with a video of the WTC attack, throw in some closeup footage of the mangled remains of American troops who had been blown to bits by IEUs. The first witnesses would be a couple of widows, followed by a couple of multiple amputees — in uniform.
Having set the context for the jury, we can turn to whether it was Morally Evil And Beyond The Bounds Of Human Decency to put some of the gun-toting locals in a box with some bugs.
I’ve never had a jury bring back a defense verdict without leaving the box. But there’s always a first time.
[But let’s not argue: Can I get some of that LSD? Please? It’s been years since I’ve been as far removed from Reality as the typical Wonketteer.)
[”Israel does not torture.” That SLAYS me.)
Oh, and I left out the part of having the jury experience that remarkable combination of carbonized meat, hot shit, and acid gagging chemicals that you taste in the back of your throat for days (rather than just smell in your hair and the backs of your hands) after “enjoying” an explosion in the middle of a crowd of people.
(Do you know how far a 10-year-old’s head will fly propelled by about 3 kilos of Semetex wrapped in a vest? It’s AMAZING! WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!)
So you think you could get torturers found not guilty in an American court, and you used four paragraphs to elaborate on this. And this has what to do with what sati said? I don’t remember the discussion being whether Neilist could defend torturers in court. But feel free to make it about you. And please feel free to add more graphic descriptions of the results of suicide bombings. That is totally relevant to the discussion.
And please tell us how the CIA torturing people randomly plucked from the battlefield = putting their lives on the line to protect me.
You are a master of going off in a completely different direction, building a straw man, burning him down and declaring victory. Mission accomplished, sir.
You obviously don’t actually wish to debate the merits of torture, which is fine. But you could at least try to amuse someone other than yourself if you’re going to evade the actual issue at hand.
Neilist: O.K., Neil, let’s look at this scenario. Somebody in the government reads your posts here, because you know they’ve got people reading the posts here, and they realize that you are a gun nut who might very well have friends in right-wing militias, who could very well pose a threat to the public safety.
So, they bring you in to ask you a few questions. They slap you around a bit. Throw you up against a wall a few times. Strap you to a board and hold your head under water until you think you are going to drown, repeatedly. Keep you in a cold room which is too small to stand up in, or lie down in. Starve you for a few days.
That’s O.K., right?
Neilist: Shit dude, do you know how much further you could propel a baby’s head with 2000 lbs of Tritonal High Explosive? Shit man Semtex ain’t shit. USA #1!
Wait, what?
You know, I usually avoid ad hominem attacks, but this Neilist guy is a real dog turd.
gurukalehuru:
Neilist is a conceited dog masturbater not worthy of argument.
Johnathon Turley is on Rachael Maddow talking about how it is a violation of the President’s oath to avoid prosecuting this war-crime….
gurukalehuru: Servo: Aw, he’s alright — he’ll fit in as soon as he takes some acid and learns Indonesian.
Also, blogwhoring.
Servo: Neilist: the “Craigslist” for wackos.
These memos?
TL:DR
Cicada: being former military, i couldn’t have said it better myself. an emphatic WIN!!
SayItWithWookies:
I, for one, refuse to entertain to Neilist’s crusade to keep pussies chalk-dry and dicks yogurt-soft.
Cicada: Well, we need to be completely honest. Torture does work, to the extent that tortured people will give up their co-conspirators (if they’re not actually conspiring, tough for them and whoever they give up, but a lot of the people tortured ARE conpirators). France stomped the life out of the Algerian insurrection in 1958, while extensively using torture. However, once the details of that came out, the French shifted from ambivalence about Algerian independence to broad support, and even DeGaulle had to go with the flow. So in the tactical short term, torture can accomplish what you’re trying to do, if you’re an evil fuck. So can mass reprisals, which the Frogs also did in Algeria.
BTW, none of the French war criminals were prosecuted, which makes the rightwinger taunt of “French = gay pussy” yet more stupid.
Neilist: Hey, good morning, friend. I made you a mojito and a bowl of hot oatmeal. They won’t change the past, but they might help you look forward. To some well-placed prosecutions. No joy in my mudville of a heart, but there’s all kinds of dirty work to do and cleaning up the messes left by others is work with a long history in what passes for civilization.
Here, I made you another mojito. Already had a couple myself. Sunrise in an hour or so where I’m at. It’ll be a beautiful day. Don’t let them get away.
Torture is for creating a scapegoat, not for gathering useful intelligence.
Anyone else see torture apologist extroidinaire Douchebourgh this am? He actually said that Sept. 11 happened because we had de-moralised the CIA under Clinton and they were afraid of getting good intel. Guess he’s never heard of of the NIA briefing, that was ignored, thus, Sept. 11. Ahhhh… I love the smell of revisionist history in the morning.
Don’t laugh, the plan was to escalate this technique to include putting a prisoner inside a small box with a bag of bacon flavored Cheeze Doodles.
Couldn’t they just tell the ay-rabs that they were gonna be locked in a bathroom stall with a killer Idaho senator that was gonna poison their butts?
Lazy Media: “Torture does work . . . .” Whoops. Guess you, too, just became a “dog turd” . . . . But unless one is high and/or Terminally Self-Righteous, sometimes the choices one has to make in the Real World (i.e., not in Wonkette) look and smell like a series of increasingly unattractive “dog turds”: Torture to get the co-conspirators vs. watching the 10-year-old kid’s head go into low earth orbit.
hobospacejunkie: The issue was whether torture was “defensible.” Your post amounts to an admission that a jury would enter a defense verdict on any case brought to trial. But I realize that people like you don’t believe in juries . . . unless they enter a verdict that you, in your Infinite Moral Wisdom, agree with. As the jury system is one of the foundations of American Democracy, that makes you a . . . ?
bago: Foreign wines. Foreign cars. Foreign women. Foreign explosives. It’s a global market nowadays.
gurukalehuru: “Okay”? Or “defensible,” both legally and morally? Not “okay” by me is not the same as the latter. “Into each life, a little rain must fall . . . and the occasional bug dropped on a suspect.” There is no “perfection” in any system operated by human beings. Most adults realize that . . . unless they are really, Really, REALLY high.
slappypaddy: I’ll take the oatmeal, if it’s Irish steel cut. But you can keep the mojito. Those are drunk by vacationing Cuban-American terrorists who try to overthrow the legitimate government of Cuba by blowing up South American airliners. Or are those “freedom fighters”? I’m confused again.
Got to go: Got a deposition, and I don’t have any more time to watch you people calling poor, misguided Lazy Media a “dog turd.”
Delicious: Blub: hmm no, actually it’s brigham young u. I wantz a lol pls?
Neilist: Well played, sir, well played. You certainly do know your juries.
Is this suppose to surprise us?
It is sort of expected.
Here is the TIME report: http://www.governmentalityblog.com/my_weblog/2009/04/bush-approved-use-of-insects-as-torture.html
Neilist: No, dipshit, I’m not agreeing with you; quite the opposite.
Neilist: yea, Israel has perfected other methods of getting information. You may be going on old information.
Lets see, if your ‘defendant’ is a slightly learning disabled taxi driver, what are your chances? Or if your defendant is a guy whos neighbor sold him to the military because he wanted to annex his land..it would be a bit murky, dont you think? The lawyers at Gitmo have found the paper trail is so fucked up that they cannot even figure out what these people are being charged with most of the time. It is a disgrace. If the evidence is not there, well, good luck proving anything at all.
Are all gun nuts pro-torture too? Must have something to do with that rigid barrel spurting out hot lead that gives you a hard on.
Neilist: We killed at least 33 people by torturing them to death. Only one was involved in any kind of terrorism, the guy the suffocated in a sleeping bag. Lets see a dead man talk, and then you may have a point.
Who else thinks that Dick Cheney would have released these himself after 5 minutes of being deprived of beef?
Neilist: Move over Jack Bauer! We have a lawyer ready to get his hands dirty for freedom. Neilist will do what it takes, to who ever might or might not have information, to secure your freedoms. Jesus lurves you, Neilist. We. Lurve. You.
Fucking prick.
this is EXACTLY summer camp. Didn’t your fellow campers ever wrap a towel around your neck to have nice handles for slamming you head-first into a wall? That was always a favorite at Camp Laughing Loon and we can see exactly how effective that technique was in stopping the Muslin terrists. Also, the making of naked pyramids of detainees, also.
shortsshortsshorts: I think the Paultard teabaggers have some shit sandwiches left over if you’re hungry.
Neilist might well be a lawyer. He talks purty words and contorts the truth to make his point.
Of course he’s the evil kind of lawyer that makes the non-lawyers hate lawyers.
He’s good at the Rovian tactic of accusing his opponet of exactly what he himself is doing.
Is it worth it, friends? I’m too frustrated with the sad reality of the last 8 years to summon the energy to debate a troll.
i remember seeing a program (might have been the history channel, i know, i know,) the point; u.s. intelligence officer saying that the most valuable information he obtained came from treating prisoners with respect and engaging in conversation over a chess board,while pretending to know more than he did. the very strategy that my mother used.