Here’s a major chunk of the big Jon Stewart-Jim Cramer Daily Show interview that aired earlier tonight. “Devastating” is just not the right word. It’s hard to remember the last time a teevee interview left us in such a state of stunned silence. As is often the case, Stewart interrupts his guest way too frequently given the breadth of his questions. But you can’t just cast this aside as some popular fake news comedy show host pulling a stunt for ratings. It’s the most ruthlessly honest, sobering conversation — from both sides — you’re likely to see on any show. Good. And note the lack of shouting. [YouTube]

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  1. WHATEVER JON STEWART PROB-LEE WORKED FOR BEAR STERNS OR SOMETHING. JIM CRAMER IS JUST AN INNOCENT BYSTANDER IN THIS WHOLE obvious swath of bullshit he managed to attribute many, many people too. Personally, we have a duty to blame this on the policies of Bill Clinton. Not out of logic, but because SEAN HANNITY IS FUCKING RIGHT ON.

  2. Sadly, it would have been better if it wasn’t just Cramer Stewart tore into but everyone on CNBC, the people who ran banks, hedge fund managers, mortgage brokers who suckered poor people into buying houses with crazy mortgages, economists who thought the financial system was just honky dory, politicians who created the system and helped deregulate the financial system, and anyone who thinks the government shouldn’t come down on these people because it would “hurt the economy.”

  3. Ya and it’s only 12 a.m. for us west coast people. Sorry we aren’t cool enough for basic cable yet. Someday California will get the same luxuries as you east coast types, such as electricity, and a direct gas connection.

  4. This interview was totally unbelievable, in the best way possible. I’m full of semi-respect for Jim Cramer for his reaction and the fact that he wasn’t being a totally slimy, fake scumbag like Bill O’Reilly always is or Tucker Carlson was. Stewart has perfected the act of grabbing onto these fuckers nuts and squeezing them in his vice-like grip while America rejoices!

  5. Is Cramer a nice guy or was he given very specific orders from his network on how he should present himself and what he should say and not say?

    Was that a smile or clenched teeth?

    Regardless, it doesn’t do anybody any good if he’s a nice guy if he doesn’t understand that finance is not a cute game designed to entertain rich people. At least, that’s not all it is.

  6. Yeah, the lack of shouting was incredible. Cramer was there like some bad schoolkid at the principal’s office, knowing he had screwed up.

    It’s still unbelievable that Stewart’s “fake” news show is more powerful news than the “real” news.

  7. I just hope Asshat Cramer isn’t able to make any hay out of his exposure to the folks who will be running American in 10-12 years….

  8. Cramer plays ball on Stewart and Colbert and then scurries back to CNBC and proceeds to froth like an absolute fucktard. It’s about time Stewart called him on his shit; Cramer was one of the sleazy bad guys jerking off into gramma’s retirement funds. Now he’s just a red-faced, shouty cheerleader for the same conniving plutocrats he used to circle jerk with, only pretending now and then to give a fuck to the little guy he is in fact manipulating. Cramer is the bald, ruddy tip of the shitberg, but it’s good to chip away at these fuckers, who know matter how many times they get exposed, always seem to float to the fucking top, because, as always, money talks, walks, and stiffens cocks.

  9. I happened to be visiting my mother when this came on. On a commercial break, I turned to her, and said, “remember when I got caught with porn? Yeah, Cramer’s acting like I did” what was with all the excuses? That was just… uncomfortable.

  10. Jon Stewart described the market as a ‘crap shoot’ and Jim Cramer agreed. Running numbers on Peachtree street is on par with Wall Street, but the numbers get no mention by the network talking heads. Blame anyone you like and or praise your favorite talking head, but know this, if you lost money in the latest stock market jackoff, you will never get it back. And you, we, are going to pay the lose back to the same greedy motherfuckers.

  11. [re=264585]Uncle Bubba[/re]: You can sleep when you’re dead ! Now get back to work – those trucknutz don’t just make themselves, you know…

  12. All kidding aside, when I think back on this lovely economic crisis in years to come (perhaps while heating a can of beans over a tire fire), this will be one of the watershed moments. The best part was when Jon looked down at the table for a long, long moment of silence, at least by TV standards, then looked dead into Cramer’s eyes and said very quietly, “You have no idea how angry this makes me.”

    Dignified rage, thy name is Stewart.

    He’s like Johnny Carson and Walter Cronkite rolled into one.

  13. Hey, People. Yeah, People here. Excuse me, did somebody (like CNVC) miss the old 35-1 P/E? Oh yeahr, P slash E, remember how that made your thighs stick together? Jon Stewart was pointing out there was a basic lack of journalism on that network, alot worse than the convicted MSNBC (mommy, what’s EM-Ess mean?) Check sources. Like talking to people and getting quotes and calling more people. I know I am not a reporter but back when I was it was the editors who were lazy and generating corrections. Now the reporters are clueless unless they a have a Gawker or a New Yorker or a TPM or HP to swing around, and even then its like PEOPLE! It’s of, by and for! Now more than even. Amen!

  14. i like the genius ‘shortsshortsshorts’ up top that states that john stewart probably worked for bear sterns(i guess because he’s a jew in nyc…but the rightwing nutjubs arent racists) and that Hannity is right and its all bill clinton’s fault(yeah, shocking revelation from hannity….not one of the brain-dead viewers thinks to himself they could have saved their time from watching fox news and just blamed clinton/liberals/aclu for everything wrong in their lives).

    Its amazing how surreal the world has become that daily news is forced to ask actual questions because the death of journalism before our eyes.

  15. [re=264593]BluesBoos[/re]: Not to break the fourth wall of our ironic detachment here, but are you kidding? I hope so, because the alternative is that you’re retarded.

  16. Who knows?

    But this might end up on a par with Edward R. Murrow’s thing on “See It Now” with Joe McCarthy.

    And it’ll be forever dismissed by some as a comedy show.

    It’s more like neo-medieval; the Jester is the only one who speaks truth to power.

  17. [re=264596]Gallowglass[/re]: what style of kidding is preferred by your particular lobbying interest? im willing to entertain requests, but my Patterson ghostwriting voice really isnt worth a damn, just as a disclosure.

  18. [re=264600]BluesBoos[/re]: Its not so much your politics, but that you don’t seem to get that “Shortsshortsshorts” is making a funny by pretending to be a member of the Fox News demographic. Its not an unusual thing here, although it would be easy to mistake his snark (Now I owe David Denby royalties) for sincerity if we were having this discussion in the AOL political forums or FishbowlDC. If you were making a joke by pretending to not understand that he is pretending to be a mouth breather then its one level of irony more than I’m used to and I apologize.

  19. [re=264604]Gallowglass[/re]: no i have to apologize…I moved to Arizona(not one of the blue areas in it, either) and have lost my sense of snark over the past year. what ‘shorts’ stated could have come from any number of my new neighbors for many miles. I came after i realized i cant get a good gab session in everyday life anymore…most of my day is biting down remarks in reaction to redstate ‘wit’.

  20. pretty weak tea if you ask me. the revolution will not be televised. better than nothing I guess. but a real honest and powerful moment would be let’s say Stanford L. Kurland getting guillotined.

  21. I like that all week Stewart was going “Oh heh look at this somehow I’m accidentally fighting Jim Cramer how wacky” but then still took him to task.

  22. [re=264593]BluesBoos[/re]: Ah, noob, read a few more shorts posts before taking him to task (or seriously). Or just look up “irony” in the dictionary; that works, too.

  23. Shit, NPR just told everyone to go watch it on, which means I’ll be lucky if their servers cool down in time to watch it before the middle school kids get home and start hogging the bandwidth. Thanks, commies.

  24. I notice Morning Schmoe & dingbat sidekick Mika are amazingly quiet about this today. I think ‘white & bitter’ Joe figured he better STFU or he would be next.

  25. I’ll believe Cramer will go back and have a complete makeover of his show. Mad Money will be mad at wall street and he’ll take the daily headlines from the WSJ and make fun of them, with an occasional interview with some comedian so he’ll be taken serious. What? too much like the Bizzaro Daily Show? Fuck. Okay, I believe Cramer will regain his credibility after he issues heartfelt apologies to Rush……!and Acorn

  26. I had to cut away a couple of times because…god help me…I felt bad for Jim Cramer, of all people to waste precious sympathy on. Then I thought of what a giant hedgefunding douchebag he is and laughed at his squirming and not-quite-apologizing.

  27. “Pleasantly uncomfortable” really is the perfect description of this interview. It was so awkward and painful, I had to flip the channel several times, but only for like five seconds, because it was still so good. It’s easy to say that Stewart didn’t let the guest talk, which he often does, but I honestly think this time that it was more that CRAMER HAD NOTHING TO SAY! Everything Stewart was saying was pretty much bang-on, and Cramer knew it, so he just sort of shrugged and smiled in a pained way and waited for the hell to end. And I actually think Stewart made it clear that, though he was a convenient target and sitting across from him, this wasn’t just about Cramer and hadn’t started out as some sort of personal witchhunt on him. If it’d been Santelli there, I think Stewart would have publicly disemboweled him.

  28. [re=264626]ushekim[/re]: Uhmm…yeah, that’s the whole point. This entertainer/comedian actually did some research & based on that research had the trucknutz to say out loud what some real investigative ‘journalists’ should have.


  30. [re=264626]ushekim[/re]: Yes, I agree with your!!!11!!!! FTW!!!!!11!!!! How dare he!!!! I am wealthy thanks to Jim Cramer!!!11!!!! Or was!!!111!!! or !!!!1111!!!!!!!!!!

    TAX CUTS!!!!!!!

  31. The key word is “both.” Both Cramer and Stewart are entertainers. You don’t buy stocks from their advice, do you? That was Stewart’s point.

  32. Just an idea (pretend like this is all capitals), but maybe there could be a real news show that asks people the same sorts of questions that Stewart and Colbert ask on teh comedy channel.

    Like I say, just an idea.

  33. [re=264607]Norbert[/re]: the revolution will not be televised.

    You should become, like, an overrated black jazz poet who is now drunk on stage most of the time they let him near it.

  34. Cramer got pwned. It’s like high school.

    Jon cracks wise about Santelli, a football tight end. So then the whole CNBC team says, “Jon Stewart is toast after school,” with Cramer being particularly vocal about it.

    So Jon goes “Cramer’s a pussy. And here’s instant replays of all his fumbles all season long.”

    So Cramer’s all “I’ll show that little bitch a thing or two after school.”

    And Jon’s all like “Bring it, fumble fingers.”

    So Cramer sez “I am SO gonna crush that fucker’s tiny little nuts with my bare hands.”

    But after school, Cramer just gives Jon a lovely reacharound and sez “Can’t we just be friends?”


  35. I think Jon let him go easy… Out of compassion.
    Yeah it was uncomfortable, but after what I’ve seen him do to Huckabee (regarding gay marriage), this almost feel a feet rub. But then again, Cramer didn’t put much of a fight. Went in with his head down already, hoping for compassion… and truth is, he got it.
    I’m with you, I’ll get the tar and feathers.

  36. [re=264651]A Fine National Imbalance[/re]: Oh good! Another troll! Yes, it’s all the shortsellers fault…You and Cramer both agree and are like psychic twins!

  37. [re=264631]Boojum[/re]: You’re not quite there, Boojum. You spelled “Jon”, “is”, and “also” correctly. I have literally seen comments from some folks, usually discussing Obama’s birth certificate, where even “is” and “also” were fucked up.

    Once, one of these assholes tried to spell “wealth redistribution.”

    How I wish I’d kept that. It was beyond belief and beyond description.

    I laughed at him on the site. I was assured, by the others there, that Americans don’t need to know how to spell, they only need to know how to shoot Liberals.

    Sigh …

  38. Not to poo poo on the snark, but here’s a bit of honesty for all of the Wonketeers. I’m currently enrolled in a top-25 MBA program, and I can tell you that the curriculum that we’re following reinforces all of the shenanigans that led to the current financial crisis. The so called academics haven’t learned their lessons, current business students are bound to repeat recent mistakes, and we haven’t seen the end of this. Fail.

  39. Either I’m out of words or I have too many of them. Why are the politicians clowns and the clowns statesmen? Where is the face of the nightly news calling for the heads of people who FUCKED THE ECONOMY TO DEATH?

  40. [re=264634]lazyb[/re]: Indeed. I have it on good authority from every mouthbreather on the net that ACORN caused this entire financial crisis. All of it.

    Sigh …

  41. BTW, I’m noticing a new meme in Christian Wingnutland: People are saying that the “rich”, whom Jesus castigates in several of the Gospels, would *today* refer to the “Poor” … ’cause today’s Poor are all lazy ‘n’ stuff, like the Rich were back in 30AD or so, but the Rich today are just the grooviest most deserving people on the entire planet, and specially beloved by Jesus. You can tell, ’cause … they’re Rich!

    So when Jesus in the Bible calls out the “Rich”, he really means to call out ACORN.

    Do these people listen to themselves?

    That’s almost as funny as the sermon I remember hearing when I was 8 years old, in my family’s upper-crust Episcopal Church, that explained the Scripture “it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter Heaven” thusly:

    One of the gates in the walls of Jerusalem was colloquially called “the Eye of the Needle”, because it was short and somewhat narrow. Before a laden camel could pass through the “Eye of the Needle”, his handlers had to remove his burdens and set them down, walk the camel through the “Eye”, pass the burdens through, then place them back on Mr. Camel’s back.

    So it was a matter of moderate difficulty, and some thought and planning, to pass a camel through the Eye of the Needle, and the burdens would have to be *temporarily* laid down. But certainly not impossible! Oh my goodness, no. Everyone there could *relax*. Jesus would never *actually* say there was anything *wrong* with being rich.

    Sigh …

    I was *8*, and I could tell this was horseshit of the purest ray serene.

    That was the year I realized a lot of grownups lie all the fucking time, especially about money and their relationship to it.

  42. YAY for Jon Stewart calling the clown an asshole! That makes EVERYTHING better! Because Jon Stewart isn’t just some authorized stand-in for legit rage that’ll get defused by him punching another TV talking head! EVERYTHING’S DIFFERENT NOW THAT MEDIA CELEBRITIES HAVE SPOKEN TO EACH OTHER ON TELEVISION.

  43. [re=264699]King of Pants[/re]: There is a reason why this is getting so much play, you know. This appearance, like Stewart’s appearance on Crossfire, crystallizes what a lot of people are feeling right now. That is why people are talking about it on teh interwebs and teh teevee and even on teh NPR.

    But yeah, it didn’t cure the economic crisis SO IT’S TOTAL BULLSHIT.

  44. Something I just read on another blog, but is equally worth the question: Cramer and CNBC aren’t the only media that screwed the pooch on this economic collapse. There’s many more television channels that did the same thing, and a large group of print outlets that would occasionally ask questions, but rarely deliver hard, insightful answers.

    Cramer’s not the only mea culpa we should hear in this. That’s the bad part.

  45. [re=264697]iolanthe[/re]: …grownups lie all the fucking time, especially about money and their relationship to it.”

    Santa and the Easter Bunny. Also.

  46. [re=264730]Chickensmack[/re]: This is true, but CNBC is the latest to have some asshole screaming about what “losers” average joes who got fucked by this crisis are and that’s why they are taking it now. Fuck Rick Santelli and fuck CNBC.

    I’ll give Cramer his due — going on TDS to get annihilated took man sized truck nutz. If he were smart, he wouldn’t have responded to Stewart’s initial rant but better to take your comeuppance and get it over with. (Unlike Santelli who pulled out of his own daily show appearance because he and CNBC are big fat pussies.) I’m not sure how Cramer’s show can go on in its current form. After last night, it’s going to seem even more retarded than before.

  47. [re=264697]iolanthe[/re]: I recently had an epiphany about the Eye of the Needle. It wasn’t about possession, it was that the rich dude wasn’t paying attention. Jesus was talking about doing loving, neighborly things, and compassion, and bringing people to be closer to one another. Rich dude thought it was a ride to heaven.

    Personally, I think Jesus dismissed him. “Well shit, dude… if all you’re concerned about is heaven, then do something big that will get you there. And leave me the fuck alone right now… because it’s excruciatingly clear that you weren’t listening to me the first time I said this shit.”

  48. would there be any constitutional impediments to Stewart sitting in on the next Senate Banking/Finance Committee and eliciting testimony next time instead of some blue dog democrat asking questions he doesn’t understand to his Hamptons neighbor who was also one of his top 10 campaign contributors?

    also, i hope cramer is preparing a monosyllabic crayon version of his resume. he was discredited just enough to join the ranks of Ollie North, Gordon Liddy, and Mark Fuhrman as Fox News contributors. Tucker Carlson really should’ve sent him his gigantic bottle of astroglide before that debacle. Also. Cramer did for rolled sleeves what Carlson did for bow ties. Also.

  49. Stewart hit the issue dead on…

    Wall Street used the pension funds and 401Ks of America to provide the capital for their games.

    The bailout is no different. Privatize the profit but nationalize the risk because they claim the alternative is too terrible to contemplate.

    Those alternatives to bailing out the banks has not been explored or explained to the American public.

    Also, I get really pissed off when anyone tries to pass off responsibility for this cluster F*** to (insert politician name here) in order to claim innocence for their party or president. Bullshit! Just because the guy down the street robs a liquor store doesn’t make it ok for me to do the same. Ultimately, they ALL had a hand in it, but Wall Street pulled the trigger.

    Capitalism must be monitored, controlled and regulated. I am terribly sorry if this reality is contrary to someone’s tiny-brained ideology.

    I lied….I’m not sorry…just angry…as usual.

  50. I couldn’t watch but a few minutes, I’ve about lost all my retirement and seeing that pompus cocksucker justify himself made me kinda ill.

    The whole lyin’ lot of them should be stood up and shot.

  51. Jim Cramer richly deserved that gutting he received. I still hope after watching that, however, that someone’s staying with Cramer to make sure he doesn’t hang himself. Because that would ruin it.

  52. [re=264697]iolanthe[/re]: O yes. After our beloved barely closeted gay leftish Catholic priest retired (to Miami of course)we were shopping for a new church and were told basically the same thing by a priest in a smugly wealthy parish. So, hooray, heaven forbid the rich should feel maybe a little uncomfortable about their excess. I understand that upper-class self doubt makes Jesus weep.
    [re=264639]Boojum[/re]: Perfect.

  53. I think Jim Cramer needs to roll up his sleeves and get back to work. Oh wait, that’s already part of his faux Gordon Gekko schtick. Why doesn’t he fuck off instead then.

  54. [re=264746]Chickensmack[/re]: When scales fall from one’s eyes it is not pretty nor does it feel good.

    Teh CNBC is tip of the iceberg that brought down the Titanic.

    The most poignant moment is Stewart talking about how his mother believed in the overall culture of investment ideology. It is arresting because amidst all the “reality” teevee and MSM reporting THIS was more real than almost any bit of media in years. And of course it made us uncomfortable because we know he hit on the most salient fact of this breakdown: greedy, selfish, jerks pwned us.

    No one else (it seems) is capable of not only “reporting,” but just mere humanity in the MSM. Humanity or its lack, I might add, that snarking helps reveal. (Note to Denby et al.)

    Agree that the court jester is the last person able to speak truth to power because everyone else drank the kool-aid. Since he is in the business of making kool-aid who would know better not to trust it?

  55. those guys at CNBC are rotten! that said, does anybody know where I can get a full size color poster of Becky Quick? (preferably scantily clad)

  56. [re=264758]AngryAtheist[/re]: Point located. It’s not that some people were doing some illegal things, or that Cramer recommended a bad stock. It’s that CNBC was (is?) unequivocally devoted to feeding the get-rich-quick financial demon that would inevitably and obviously collapse into the hellstorm in which we currently try to survive.

    Shit. I need a drink nao.

  57. I couldn’t stand to watch Cramer’s okays and fair enoughs and I’m tryings. He was like some slouchy married guy excusing himself to a rightfully angry wife. He’s just lucky that Stewart’s a model of reason and calm – and didn’t try to beat him to death with an electric guitar.

  58. [re=264685]Mild Midwesterner[/re]: I’m working towards my MBA at the moment, as well, and the first few required courses I took really focused on ethical business and not screwing people over, which I found pretty heartening. However, my basic Accounting class hasn’t really worked in ethics too much…

  59. Jim Cramer should have passed on reacting so strongly on other shows to Jon Stewart’s jibes. Instead, with typical TV bravado, he dismissed Stewart as just a comedian and agreed to the interview with the thought that he would steamroll this guy.

    As others have found out, that’s not a good idea. Jon Stewart is smart, knows how to use the language and his medium, and Jim Cramer got his ass scroched. Hell of an interview. Jon did his homework.

    Last year, Cramer was asked by a caller about AT&T, which had just fallen to 31. Great deal! Can’t lose! At 31, buy, buy, but. Lots of horn-honking. I bought some. My own, bad stupid decision for investing without thoroughly looking at the big picture. But, thanks for the timely advice, Jim. Would like you better had you horn-honked the best CD rates in the nation at the time. It’s a matter of trust, and after Stewart’s BBQ showed you explaining how to roll the market, I think you’re just another shill for the bankers.

  60. [re=264950]Incredulicious[/re]: Yes. Actually, it would be nice if he was just being smart and funny but as he appears to be the only to call BS on Jim Cramer and CNBC, then somebody’s got to do it. Once the news channels start doing something other than having two political hacks yell talking points at each other or feature some raving lunatic crying all sorts of crazy things without anybody calling them on it then, all we have is Jon Stewart.

  61. I’m as big a “Daily Show” fan as there is and I had to keep flipping away from this. Man, Jim Cramer is such a douche. I had a sinking feeling when he walked on stage that he had no idea what he was in for. I actually felt a little bad for him, though he did bring it on himself. Not just because of his show, but because of the way he’s dismissed Stewart all week as just a “comedian,” when anyone who watches “Daily Show” knows that those guys are some of the most trenchant and brutal satirists around.

  62. [re=264946]Principal Blackman[/re]: I can not wrap my head around the fact that that story is relating the truth, and isn’t the plot for an overly-dramatic Mafia intrigue book of fiction.

    Someone, please tell me that people like that don’t really exist outside of movies and books.

  63. [re=264697]iolanthe[/re]: Likewise a scion of upper crust Episcopalian churches (I was the comparatively poor kid), I’ve heard that kind of bullshit before and even as a child it struck me as disingenuous. Mostly our priest ignored anything anti-wealth, but the pastors of the Baptist mega-churches some of my friends attended bought in to “prosperity theology” heart and soul. Its what Al Franken (I shudder to invoke his name) called “Supply Side Jesus”. I prefer “Grifter Theology”.

    “Of the purest ray serene” is a lovely turn of phrase. I’m going to use it, but I’ll think of you when I do.

  64. I’m told Cramer is a charming guy when he wants to be, and I think we saw that in full yesterday. Props for taking it like a man. And Stewart, well… what’s there to say. When he lets the smart out, no one’s safe.

  65. The real story is why no one else, or few others have the credibility to take these kinds of stories on. Can you spell suck-up wannabe lackeys?

  66. Mild Midwesterner: um, I’m a totally newbie so if what you said was some sort of joke I’m sorry, BUT just because some jerk in a jacket with patched elbows* tells you it’s ok, doesn’t make it ok. I don’t understand how you can excuse clearly unethical behavior by saying “oh some ivory tower elitest told me to do it”. uh what? I don’t care if the dean of harvard told me to punch a baby and take its candy, I wouldn’t do it because it is clearly WRONG. maybe I have some sort of ethical super power that makes me able to tell right from wrong with no one telling me, but I’m reasonably certain that creating a false sense of urgency (aka LYING) to fleece idiot investors who get caught up in the hype is somehow unethical.
    I’m sorry i’m not up on the new lingo, are they calling them “marks” now?
    Does a con artist teach your class?
    Don’t forget to blame those idiots for falling for the lies btw. Isn’t it hilarious when intrinsically honest people assume you’re telling them the truth because they don’t lie all the time. *gasps for air* oh my god, I’m laughing so hard I can’t breathe. Granted, no one is completely blameless. Some people just wanted fast easy money from their investments, but the ones who lost their 401Ks that they’ve been putting money into for years so they can retire, those are the real a$$holes.
    Last time I checked you don’t have to check your brains or morals at the door when you take college classes. sooo yeah.

    *disclaimer: i actually like jackets with patched elbows.

  67. [re=265014]Gallowglass[/re]: Later in my life, from 1978-1986, I had a “born again experience”, and ended up becoming a charter member of Focus on the Family and a firebreathing Evangelical Charismatic Soulwinner. (Yes, I knocked on peoples’ doors and bothered them about Jesus.)

    I heard the prosperity teaching; and the “shepherding” teaching (where everybody in a church has to report to some *other* member of the church who serves as their “covering”, kind of a mini-pope); and the Authority teaching, where questioning the pastor’s word … or one’s husband’s word … or Bill Gothard’s word … was tantamount to questioning God himself; during an illness church members came over to attempt to exorcise demons from my stove and my cat; I burned at fine collection of irreplaceable European rock records, etc. etc. In my defense, I was never a convinced Biblical Literalist or young-earther, and I never could renounce Evolution.

    I mostly enjoyed the exuberant praise and worship. And under those guys, I really *did* read the Bible cover-to-cover several times.

    But I had my *second* born-again experience the day we were supposed to be swaying with our eyes closed and hands in the air, murmuring in tongues, waiting to greet our Guest Speaker. I peeked, and realized that my hands were in the air to a *picture of Ronald Reagan* projected on the screen we used for hymn lyrics and verses for meditation.

    I snatched my hands down, dimly remembering, partly from Episcopal Sunday School, that the *hero* of the Bible Story was *never* the guy who salaamed to the King, but rather the person who refused to do so (cf. books of Daniel, Esther, etc.)

    Then the Guest Speaker got up and told us all about how we had to reclaim America for Christ, because America was a Christian Nation, etc. etc. that the Evil Liberals were leading astray.

    Now — I’d actually *read* stuff Jefferson and Franklin had written.
    So I knew this was crap.
    And I got out of there.

    For years, I’d warn people about the theocratic First-Amendment-Flouting agenda of the Religious Right, and they wouldn’t believe me. As recently as last year, one of the more reasonable right-wing debaters on one of my social networks, some kind of wealthy Catholic conservative lawyer, told me he’d never met any Christians like those I’d described and did not believe they actually existed. He was certain I’d made them up.

    And then the Repubs nominated Sarah Palin.

    She was even the same denomination that I had been in 1978-1986.

  68. Way late in the thread, but I’m reminded that Glenn Greenwald called Colbert’s speech at the Bush press dinner the best political speech of the Bush years. Unlike the MSM, Colbert and Steward both speak the unvarnished truth w/out worrying about stepping on toes.

  69. [re=265165]iolanthe[/re]: Thanks for sharing. Seriously. You are a brave person for showing us your closet o’ skeletons. Thank you.

  70. [re=265165]iolanthe[/re]: [re=264621]Lazy Media[/re]: thanks for the suggestion that puts your internetz wisdom to such a kingly state and insults me all at once! even after i explained why, it takes character…exactly what type of character is the only question remaining. but i grovel to your very important quibble…and beg mercy for the razor lash of thy wit, starbucks Voltaire…

  71. I hate sports commenters, they have no value to add, they just say stuff regardless of what’s going on. Jim Cramer is worse than a sports commenter.

  72. Thanks to iolanthe, this was the best comment thread I’ve ever read. Even if BluesBoos is overly sensitive and that “People” person up towards the top there is clearly on drugs.

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